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Deca versus EQ for anti-inflammatory and collagen-synthesis joint health.

greco

greco

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I have both heard others say, and have experienced first hand, the benefits of deca regarding joints. I'm not sure of the exact mechanism, but between anti-inflammatory effects and collagen-synthesis effects, my joints feel better on deca. I now use a little deca with TRT, about 100mg / week along with TRT 250/week, and it seems to help. My question is, since EQ is so related to Deca, does anyone have knowledge regarding if EQ behaves the same regarding joint health? Either way, whatever your answer, why does it or doesn't it?

A little more information to give context. I'm planning to start a Test/EQ cycle soon, and will stop the TRT does of deca, since it seems redundant. However, should I keep the low dose deca in there? Why or why not?
 
Wardamn said:
Mg for mg EQ inscreases collagen synthesis more than Nandrolone.
Click to expand...
So, does that mean you'd recommend EQ over Nandrolone for connective tissue repair?
 
eq is better than deca for collagen synthesis
 
rawbuilt said:
eq is better than deca for collagen synthesis
Click to expand...
How have you used it for that purpose and how did you measure the outcome. my first cyucle back after 10 years I had some tendonitis. The cycle was test and eQ and it was healed by the end of the cycle. Not sure it was the EQ but interested in your experience.
 
Glycomann said:
How have you used it for that purpose and how did you measure the outcome. my first cyucle back after 10 years I had some tendonitis. The cycle was test and eQ and it was healed by the end of the cycle. Not sure it was the EQ but interested in your experience.
Click to expand...
had some nagging injuries for months ran some eq and it was completed healed at the end of the cycle

there's also studies showing eq out performs nandrolone for collagen synthesis
 
Wardamn said:
Mg for mg EQ inscreases collagen synthesis more than Nandrolone.
Click to expand...
This 👆

I think the problem we see though is that some guys tend to not run enough test to offset the EQ estrogen lowering effect so they end up being to "dry" and they don`t get the joint benefits that they should otherwise get while running EQ.

greco said:
So, does that mean you'd recommend EQ over Nandrolone for connective tissue repair?
Click to expand...
I`m not convinced that EQ, Deca etc "repairs" anything per say. It`s more or less masking the pain which means when you come off the compound the "joint benefits" will be lost. I`m open to discussion on this topic though as I am any topic. I`d love to be wrong though as it would be very very nice to be able to "repair" joints with these compounds but I just don`t think that`s the case.

If you want to repair then look into BPC-157 and TB-500 peptides :)
 
rawbuilt said:
had some nagging injuries for months ran some eq and it was completed healed at the end of the cycle

there's also studies showing eq out performs nandrolone for collagen synthesis
Click to expand...
Collagen is not a single entity. There are many forms and they are part of a matrix and sets of them are present in a tissue specific distribution. so even though some forms may increase the resulting tissue may not be what you think it is. Still, I have had at least one instance where a tendonitis was healed during cycle but I can't say if it happened another time or times or if the one time was a coincidence.
 
There is research about anavar showing a big improvement in collagen synthesis. In some instances a 10 or 11 fold improvement and at least doubled. Used for a variety of healing purposes including osteoarthritis, muscle wasting, burn victims and more. I don't know how eq figures into this comparatively so I'll keep reading.

 
Buff Bagwell said:
How many weeks till EQ starts doing its thing. Never tried it. You hear conflicted info
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Equipoise (Boldenone Undecylenate)

The Undecylenate ester has about a 14 day half life, so usually full saturation is 2-3x that number from what I've found. So it should be in full effect by 4-6 weeks.

Most people I've seen say it wasn't until 6-8 weeks that they could feel the difference.

I haven't personally taken EQ, but I'm interested in it for the collagen benefits specifically. Doesn't hurt that my Hematocrit is usually 47-48 so I could probably get away with the blood thickening effect.
 
Matt88 said:
This 👆

I think the problem we see though is that some guys tend to not run enough test to offset the EQ estrogen lowering effect so they end up being to "dry" and they don`t get the joint benefits that they should otherwise get while running EQ.


I`m not convinced that EQ, Deca etc "repairs" anything per say. It`s more or less masking the pain which means when you come off the compound the "joint benefits" will be lost. I`m open to discussion on this topic though as I am any topic. I`d love to be wrong though as it would be very very nice to be able to "repair" joints with these compounds but I just don`t think that`s the case.

If you want to repair then look into BPC-157 and TB-500 peptides :)
Click to expand...
I agree with this. I have rotator cuff tears, both shoulders (MRI confirmed). I did a cycle of Deca and followed it with BPC-157 and TB-500 peptides over a year ago and during the Deca cycle and for almost a year after the peptides, I felt great, and had no pain. However, slowly it's coming back. I had follow-up MRIs and the effect of the Deca, plus BPC-157 and TB-500 peptides was an 80%+ reduction in inflammation, and very minor "repairs," but eventually, the tear and inflammation re-asserts itself. With that said, at 55, I don't care. If I have to do that once a year for 5, 10, 15 years, as long as I'm pain free and strong, so be it. If I was 25 with 60+ years to go, I'd have surgery right now, get it over with, and have decades to keep growing. At this age, it's all about making a good end-run, and running out whatever life I have left.

In that context, I'm planning to run heavy test with EQ, partially to do as you suggest, to offset the EQ "drying" effect. Do you have any suggestion on dosages, with the following background; 55, very mature lifter, very strong, done several cycles in my lifetime, 6'4", 255, about 15% BF.
 
I keep my EQ about 500mgs less than my test dose. I don’t need a single AI this way , I’ve tried all different ratios. Too much EQ tanks my sex drive, I feel the best with this method. I aromatize heavily also, ever since I’ve found EQ I havnt touched a AI since . Test from 1-2g, EQ 500mgs less. If Dbol, drol, or nandrolone is present then I’ll take it almost even with test

Pure broscience bullshit but it works
 
greco said:
I agree with this. I have rotator cuff tears, both shoulders (MRI confirmed). I did a cycle of Deca and followed it with BPC-157 and TB-500 peptides over a year ago and during the Deca cycle and for almost a year after the peptides, I felt great, and had no pain. However, slowly it's coming back. I had follow-up MRIs and the effect of the Deca, plus BPC-157 and TB-500 peptides was an 80%+ reduction in inflammation, and very minor "repairs," but eventually, the tear and inflammation re-asserts itself. With that said, at 55, I don't care. If I have to do that once a year for 5, 10, 15 years, as long as I'm pain free and strong, so be it. If I was 25 with 60+ years to go, I'd have surgery right now, get it over with, and have decades to keep growing. At this age, it's all about making a good end-run, and running out whatever life I have left.

In that context, I'm planning to run heavy test with EQ, partially to do as you suggest, to offset the EQ "drying" effect. Do you have any suggestion on dosages, with the following background; 55, very mature lifter, very strong, done several cycles in my lifetime, 6'4", 255, about 15% BF.
Click to expand...
I agree 100% sir in that if that was me I would most certainly run that combo yearly to avoid surgery. How long did you run the bpc and tb-500 for? I know It`s next to impossible but I bet you would get more repair effect if you could manage to not use your shoulder to much during the time you are using the peptides. Then it also depends on if we are talking complete tears or partial tears as partial tears are much much easier to recover. IMO with complete tear there is often times a gap where the tear is so the rotator cuff is slightly pulled apart due to the tear making it not possible for the tissue to heal back together again. With a partial the tissue is in a much better position to heal.

Can you comment on what sort of converter you are with testosterone and other compounds? Would you consider your self a low, moderate or high converter to estrogen. What do your previous cycle setups look like dosage wise, AI use, Test/mast doses or Test/Primo doses etc
 
Dano22 said:
I keep my EQ about 500mgs less than my test dose. I don’t need a single AI this way , I’ve tried all different ratios. Too much EQ tanks my sex drive, I feel the best with this method. I aromatize heavily also, ever since I’ve found EQ I havnt touched a AI since . Test from 1-2g, EQ 500mgs less. If Dbol, drol, or nandrolone is present then I’ll take it almost even with test

Pure broscience bullshit but it works
Click to expand...
You aromatize heavily but EQ at 500mg lower than test has your E2 in a good place? That doesn`t sound like a heavy converter to me :cool: Sounds like you are a fairly low or moderate at most. I like it though bc you know what works best for you and you run it!
 
Matt88 said:
I agree 100% sir in that if that was me I would most certainly run that combo yearly to avoid surgery. How long did you run the bpc and tb-500 for? I know It`s next to impossible but I bet you would get more repair effect if you could manage to not use your shoulder to much during the time you are using the peptides. Then it also depends on if we are talking complete tears or partial tears as partial tears are much much easier to recover. IMO with complete tear there is often times a gap where the tear is so the rotator cuff is slightly pulled apart due to the tear making it not possible for the tissue to heal back together again. With a partial the tissue is in a much better position to heal.

Can you comment on what sort of converter you are with testosterone and other compounds? Would you consider your self a low, moderate or high converter to estrogen. What do your previous cycle setups look like dosage wise, AI use, Test/mast doses or Test/Primo doses etc
Click to expand...

The tears are partial. I ran bpc and tb-500 for 8 weeks, right after a text/deca cycle, and the pain went away 100% for about 6 months. For the next 6 months after that, I had minor pain once in a while, but very manageable and nothing that could slow me down. Only now, well over a year out, am I feeling any real pain, but it's still manageable.

I am a very low converter. When on TRT 200/week, my Dr prescribed Anastrozle .5mg per week, and that was enough to tank my estrogen to almost zero and I had to stop the AI. When on test/deca 600mg/300mg per week, I didn't use any AI and estrogen never got out of range. When doing test/tren 1000/400, I used .5mg Anastrozle and it was more than enough to keep estrogen in check.
 
greco said:
The tears are partial. I ran bpc and tb-500 for 8 weeks, right after a text/deca cycle, and the pain went away 100% for about 6 months. For the next 6 months after that, I had minor pain once in a while, but very manageable and nothing that could slow me down. Only now, well over a year out, am I feeling any real pain, but it's still manageable.

I am a very low converter. When on TRT 200/week, my Dr prescribed Anastrozle .5mg per week, and that was enough to tank my estrogen to almost zero and I had to stop the AI. When on test/deca 600mg/300mg per week, I didn't use any AI and estrogen never got out of range. When doing test/tren 1000/400, I used .5mg Anastrozle and it was more than enough to keep estrogen in check.
Click to expand...
You sound like me. I`m every bit as low of a converter as you are.

For me personally I need my testosterone 200mg higher than EQ or Mast or Primo or DHB etc. If I run anything less than 200mg of test higher then I get low e2 symptoms. Given how low of a converter I would start with that. Running test 200mg higher than EQ. If that`s not enough then you can titrate testosterone higher. Maybe start with something like 600 test and 400 EQ and go from there
 
Glycomann said:
Collagen is not a single entity. There are many forms and they are part of a matrix and sets of them are present in a tissue specific distribution. so even though some forms may increase the resulting tissue may not be what you think it is. Still, I have had at least one instance where a tendonitis was healed during cycle but I can't say if it happened another time or times or if the one time was a coincidence.
Click to expand...
it still increases collagen synthesis better than nandrolone
 

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