What’s one “bro science” belief you used to swear by that you’ve completely changed your mind on?

[Dchuck86]

I’ve been around this game for a long time, and one thing I’ve learned is that a lot of what we all accepted as fact 10–15 years ago doesn’t always hold up when you look at more data or personal experience.
For me, a few examples are:

• Thinking more gear always equals more growth.
• Believing AI use should always start at a specific dose regardless of bloodwork. Assuming every plateau meant I needed another compound instead of fixing training or nutrition.

Curious what everyone else has changed their mind about over the years.
What’s one piece of advice you used to defend that you wouldn’t give someone today?

 

[Machforce1]

Gonna take some heat for this one, but that you need hundreds and hundreds of grams of protein per day to grow. I’ve done it both ways, super high and moderate intake and saw no difference between the two. I tend to fall into the Mike Mentzer camp on this one.

 

[Vision]

Gonna take some heat for this one, but that you need hundreds and hundreds of grams of protein per day to grow. I’ve done it both ways, super high and moderate intake and saw no difference between the two. I tend to fall into the Mike Mentzer camp on this one.

IMO the amount of protein is not nearly as important, as carb timing, and knowing the glycemic scale. That's what I've personally learned over the years.

 

[liverpool_96]

How about in the reverse scenario of cutting though? I've always been at around about 1g/lb of bodyweight but then think that it may be better to go for lean mass. I ask because I'm currently in situation where my cals are quite low and I don't want to give more cals to protein. I'm in two minds as I think that you're less likely to lose muscle running anabolics in the first place but is 185g protein too low for someone who is around 9% at 196lbs?

 

[unseen423]

Gonna take some heat for this one, but that you need hundreds and hundreds of grams of protein per day to grow. I’ve done it both ways, super high and moderate intake and saw no difference between the two. I tend to fall into the Mike Mentzer camp on this one.

Thats a great one- once I upped my carbs, I grew! Around 1-1.25g/lb works for me, little bit of added fats, and fill the rest in with carbs!

 

[BFulforth]

Gonna take some heat for this one, but that you need hundreds and hundreds of grams of protein per day to grow. I’ve done it both ways, super high and moderate intake and saw no difference between the two. I tend to fall into the Mike Mentzer camp on this one.

Nah. I agree with you. Yes, we need it for repair amongst other functions, but I believe carbs are more important for growth than excessive protein consumption.


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[unseen423]

One myth that I wish I could go back and change was "chicken, brown rice, and broccoli" for every meal. When I was in college, (2003-2007) this was what I ate for a large portion of my meals. 1) It tasted like shit 2) Brown rice and broccoli make me feel like shit!
It was almost like jasmine or other white rices were demonized.

 

[RandomLifter]

Amount of protein intake per day. Not close.

And distant second is that you need to lift 5x per week and 25 sets per lift to grow muscle.

 

[Phill]

Gonna take some heat for this one, but that you need hundreds and hundreds of grams of protein per day to grow. I’ve done it both ways, super high and moderate intake and saw no difference between the two. I tend to fall into the Mike Mentzer camp on this one.

And let’s not forget that you can’t eat more than 30 to 40 grams of protein per meal or it won’t be absorbed.

 

[Meetketchup]

How about in the reverse scenario of cutting though? I've always been at around about 1g/lb of bodyweight but then think that it may be better to go for lean mass. I ask because I'm currently in situation where my cals are quite low and I don't want to give more cals to protein. I'm in two minds as I think that you're less likely to lose muscle running anabolics in the first place but is 185g protein too low for someone who is around 9% at 196lbs?

In a deficit you would want more protein. I would definitely increase your intake at 196lbs. You always want to have a buffer of more protein because having too little is no bueno. Also, excess protein is not the same as eating excess carbs/protein. In a surplus calorie environment in which carbs are high is the time you can ease up on protein since carbs are protein sparing.

 

[liverpool_96]

I get what you're saying but don't the anabolics play a type of role as that buffer in that the body won't break down muscle to use as fuel? I'm just theorizing here myself, maybe to justify eating less. I don't use shakes though so one a day won't hurt to bump up the protein to around 210g. Thanks!

 

[ricroc]

Yeah, not sure why white rice got so demonized.

And let’s not forget that you can’t eat more than 30 to 40 grams of protein per meal or it won’t be absorbed.

This one had been going around for decades. Just the notion that once the body hits 40g of protein it's all lost. Oh man, I fell for that one like crazy.

Mine: the anabolic window. Did I ever fall for the marketing. Had to make sure I slammed protein shake of some kind like the second I was done with my workout. I still do this for preference rather than to miss out on that window.

 

[dcdogz]

the pump

 

[BFulforth]

In a deficit you would want more protein. I would definitely increase your intake at 196lbs. You always want to have a buffer of more protein because having too little is no bueno. Also, excess protein is not the same as eating excess carbs/protein. In a surplus calorie environment in which carbs are high is the time you can ease up on protein since carbs are protein sparing.

Brother you are such a wealth of knowledge.


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[Dchuck86]

Gonna take some heat for this one, but that you need hundreds and hundreds of grams of protein per day to grow. I’ve done it both ways, super high and moderate intake and saw no difference between the two. I tend to fall into the Mike Mentzer camp on this one.

I think this gets overstated too. Once you’re hitting a reasonable intake (around 0.7–1.0 g per lb of lean body mass for most people), the returns seem to diminish pretty quickly. Training quality, recovery, total calories, and consistency have always made a bigger difference for me than chasing 300+ grams of protein.

 

[Dchuck86]

How about in the reverse scenario of cutting though? I've always been at around about 1g/lb of bodyweight but then think that it may be better to go for lean mass. I ask because I'm currently in situation where my cals are quite low and I don't want to give more cals to protein. I'm in two minds as I think that you're less likely to lose muscle running anabolics in the first place but is 185g protein too low for someone who is around 9% at 196lbs?

I think you’re fine at 185g. At 196 lbs and ~9% BF, that’s already around 1.0 g per lb of lean mass, which is more than enough for most people—even in a cut. I’d rather use the extra calories on carbs to keep training performance up. If you’re running anabolics and training hard, preserving muscle is generally less of a concern than it is naturally. Unless you’re noticing strength dropping or recovery suffering, I wouldn’t push protein any higher.

 

[Lustyscripps]

The just shove anything and everything in your mouth when bulking. Eating lean Whole Foods at a slight surplus is the way to go. There’s a gentlemen at the gym I frequent whom I’ve literally heard say verbatim “ just go out and eat McDonald’s and some milkshakes” literally tells people with average builds (mind you NOT SKINNY WHATSOEVER) to just eat pure junk food. The guy is fat as fuck and can’t walk his fatass across the gym without getting gassed.

 

[Dchuck86]

One myth that I wish I could go back and change was "chicken, brown rice, and broccoli" for every meal. When I was in college, (2003-2007) this was what I ate for a large portion of my meals. 1) It tasted like shit 2) Brown rice and broccoli make me feel like shit!
It was almost like jasmine or other white rices were demonized.

100%. White rice got unfairly demonized for years. If you digest it better and it helps you consistently hit your calories, it’s probably the better choice for you.

 

[Dchuck86]

I get what you're saying but don't the anabolics play a type of role as that buffer in that the body won't break down muscle to use as fuel? I'm just theorizing here myself, maybe to justify eating less. I don't use shakes though so one a day won't hurt to bump up the protein to around 210g. Thanks!

Anabolics definitely help preserve lean mass in a calorie deficit—they improve nitrogen retention, protein synthesis, and reduce muscle protein breakdown. But they don’t make you immune to losing muscle if calories or protein get too low. I’d still keep protein high and let the drugs be the insurance policy, not the foundation. Bumping to ~210g sounds like a solid move.

 

[dcdogz]

The just shove anything and everything in your mouth when bulking. Eating lean Whole Foods at a slight surplus is the way to go. There’s a gentlemen at the gym I frequent whom I’ve literally heard say verbatim “ just go out and eat McDonald’s and some milkshakes” literally tells people with average builds (mind you NOT SKINNY WHATSOEVER) to just eat pure junk food. The guy is fat as fuck and can’t walk his fatass across the gym without getting gassed.

yea i feel like, not only do you put on a wicked amount of fat, but makes it harder to cut and increases cravings.
way easier to just eat more of the same or less of the same.

 

[Dchuck86]

The just shove anything and everything in your mouth when bulking. Eating lean Whole Foods at a slight surplus is the way to go. There’s a gentlemen at the gym I frequent whom I’ve literally heard say verbatim “ just go out and eat McDonald’s and some milkshakes” literally tells people with average builds (mind you NOT SKINNY WHATSOEVER) to just eat pure junk food. The guy is fat as fuck and can’t walk his fatass across the gym without getting gassed.

I think the dirty bulk mindset came from people treating calories as the only variable. Sure, you’ll grow in a surplus, but the quality of those calories still affects performance, digestion, health markers, and how much fat you gain. A small surplus with mostly whole foods gets you to the same place without spending months dieting off unnecessary fat.

 

[ThatGripGuy]

1000mg or more vit c per day when on cycle. Got into it with James Collier on this and he pointed out that the studies supported 600mg max

 

[Lustyscripps]

I think the dirty bulk mindset came from people treating calories as the only variable. Sure, you’ll grow in a surplus, but the quality of those calories still affects performance, digestion, health markers, and how much fat you gain. A small surplus with mostly whole foods gets you to the same place without spending months dieting off unnecessary fat.

yea i feel like, not only do you put on a wicked amount of fat, but makes it harder to cut and increases cravings.
way easier to just eat more of the same or less of the same.

Exactly the detrimental affects outweigh all positives. Sure you’ll grow- but how bad are you ruining your cardiovascular health- and if you’re on gear it’s even worse. It really baffles me how some people are so hard headed to even “try” a week or two of proper diet. You can still gain size and strength, and it’ll stay.

 

[RandomLifter]

In a deficit you would want more protein. I would definitely increase your intake at 196lbs. You always want to have a buffer of more protein because having too little is no bueno. Also, excess protein is not the same as eating excess carbs/protein. In a surplus calorie environment in which carbs are high is the time you can ease up on protein since carbs are protein sparing.

Great points brotha.

In the absence of excess dietary carbohydrates, excess dietary protein can be converted (likely is converted) to glucose. It is more taxing on the system (uses more energy - so helps with the cut) but it certainly means that any excess dietary protein (assuming it’s excess) will maximize amino acid conversion and then the remainder will likely be converted to glucose (in the absence of excess dietary carbohydrates).

 

[Meetketchup]

We were all guilty believing in the dirty or YOLO bulk. It should have been common sense that if you gain 40 or 50 pounds on a f it all diet in 16 weeks or so, how much of that is actually muscle and what is water, glycogen and fat. Unless you are new to lifting or a genetic freak the cold hard truth for the avg gym bro is when you cut down from such a drastic increase in weight you will be underwhelmed with the amount of lean tissue you put on. Yes, there are exceptions. I am talking most people.

Moderate caloric surplus over a long period of time, never getting sloppy FTW

 

[RandomLifter]

We were all guilty believing in the dirty or YOLO bulk. It should have been common sense that if you gain 40 or 50 pounds on a f it all diet in 16 weeks or so, how much of that is actually muscle and what is water, glycogen and fat. Unless you are new to lifting or a genetic freak the cold hard truth for the avg gym bro is when you cut down from such a drastic increase in weight you will be underwhelmed with the amount of lean tissue you put on. Yes, there are exceptions. I am talking most people.

Moderate caloric surplus over a long period of time, never getting sloppy FTW

What’s actually worked for me (albeit I’m not a pro bodybuilder, and not close)…just nothing else worked:

1) Maintain consistent protein intake no matter what
2) Maintain close to the same fat intake no matter what
3) Weight every two weeks
4) If weight stays same, lowers, increase carbs by 50g/day
5) If weight goes up by more than 1/2lb-3/4lb/wk (for me), decrease carbs/day

If strength doesn’t increase, at least some, over time, I will increase protein intake and sometimes gear (but both minimally).

 

[Dchuck86]

We were all guilty believing in the dirty or YOLO bulk. It should have been common sense that if you gain 40 or 50 pounds on a f it all diet in 16 weeks or so, how much of that is actually muscle and what is water, glycogen and fat. Unless you are new to lifting or a genetic freak the cold hard truth for the avg gym bro is when you cut down from such a drastic increase in weight you will be underwhelmed with the amount of lean tissue you put on. Yes, there are exceptions. I am talking most people.

Moderate caloric surplus over a long period of time, never getting sloppy FTW

I think social media really fueled the “bulk at all costs” mindset. Most people would be better off aiming for a small calorie surplus and focusing on progressive overload. Even enhanced guys hit a point where extra calories mostly become body fat instead of muscle. Slow, consistent growth usually ends up looking better after the cut

 

[Meetketchup]

I think social media really fueled the “bulk at all costs” mindset. Most people would be better off aiming for a small calorie surplus and focusing on progressive overload. Even enhanced guys hit a point where extra calories mostly become body fat instead of muscle. Slow, consistent growth usually ends up looking better after the cut

I'm old and the YOLO bulk was more from the 90's into the early 2000's. I think social media actually helped kill it as influencers need to stay conditioned all year round for their content, which we all know the avg gym eats up that crap content. Also, we learned a lot nutrition wise during that period when we finally had hundreds of studies and meta-analysis on nutrition to refer to.

 

[Lustyscripps]

I'm old and the YOLO bulk was more from the 90's into the early 2000's. I think social media actually helped kill it as influencers need to stay conditioned all year round for their content, which we all know the avg gym eats up that crap content. Also, we learned a lot nutrition wise during that period when we finally had hundreds of studies and meta-analysis on nutrition to refer to.

I’m convinced you have a fu Manchu.

 

[Meetketchup]

I’m convinced you have a fu Manchu.

Clean shaven. Wear a suit to work.