Hack Beginner Cycle: Test/Deca/Mast

[Raekwon]

I mostly lurk here, but appreciate youall. I’m a 43 year old dude who spent 20 of those years as an alcoholic (in recovery for years now), so I’m just glad to be here.

5’11”/210lbs. Not a brick shit house, but you can tell I lift heavy things. Too fat, probably 20% BF.

Anyway, starting my second cycle (first was straight test, 300mg/wk, and it was awesome), and I know I’m pretty sure I’ll get roasted for it, but I’m here for your entertainment:

Each week:
350mg test (sust)
300mg deca
300mg mast

I also use 3ius of HGH/day. Gonna fuck around with 20mg Tbol/day to start and finish. I take NAC and Metformin and all the boring “legal” shit too.

I’m just interested in seeing where this lands feedback-wise. Am I too fat for this cycle? Too much gear? Not a thoughtful combo? Or am I basically about to get all huge and yolked up?

 

[Swole_Wes]

I mostly lurk here, but appreciate youall. I’m a 43 year old dude who spent 20 of those years as an alcoholic (in recovery for years now), so I’m just glad to be here.

5’11”/210lbs. Not a brick shit house, but you can tell I lift heavy things. Too fat, probably 20% BF.

Anyway, starting my second cycle (first was straight test, 300mg/wk, and it was awesome), and I know I’m pretty sure I’ll get roasted for it, but I’m here for your entertainment:

Each week:
350mg test (sust)
300mg deca
300mg mast

I also use 3ius of HGH/day. Gonna fuck around with 20mg Tbol/day to start and finish. I take NAC and Metformin and all the boring “legal” shit too.

I’m just interested in seeing where this lands feedback-wise. Am I too fat for this cycle? Too much gear? Not a thoughtful combo? Or am I basically about to get all huge and yolked up?

Those aren't crazy doses of gear imo. That being said, your bf of 20%, if accurate, is a little on the high side, but I've seen worse. What's the duration of this cycle, do you have an AI on hand, and what's your plan afterward? Pct off or drop down to a cruise or trt dose?

I didn't choose the swolle life, the swolle life chose me ~ Wesley Swolle

 

[Meetketchup]

If you think you're 20% you're probably a little bit higher as most people under estimate their bodyfat, but let's say it is 20%...IMO, that's too high. I'd personally get at "least" under 15% first. Shouldn't take you long if you're serious and your body will be ready to grow.

Just one mans opinion and wish you the best.

 

[Raekwon]

Those aren't crazy doses of gear imo. That being said, your bf of 20%, if accurate, is a little on the high side, but I've seen worse. What's the duration of this cycle, do you have an AI on hand, and what's your plan afterward? Pct off or drop down to a cruise or trt dose?

I didn't choose the swolle life, the swolle life chose me ~ Wesley Swolle

I tried to overestimate BF for sure, since I feel like everyone just says they’re 8% to sound like a boss.

I’m gonna cruise after, so no PCT. Planning to go 16 weeks as long as I’m feeling good and pulling decent bloods. AI’s on hand. I guess I act like I’m fucking around to rep the more casual guys on the board who get a hard time, but I put a lil thought into it.

 

[Raekwon]

If you think you're 20% you're probably a little bit higher as most people under estimate their bodyfat, but let's say it is 20%...IMO, that's too high. I'd personally get at "least" under 15% first. Shouldn't take you long if you're serious and your body will be ready to grow.

Just one mans opinion and wish you the best.

I appreciate you, man. The reason to be low already is insulin sensitivity, right? My hope was that I may be on the high side but the metformin nerfs that a bit?

 

[Matt88]

What's your goals for the cycle? Are you going to eat in a calorie surplus or deficit? More body fat generally means higher amounts of estrogen conversion. You will get the dht benefits of the mast to keep any sexual sides from the deca at bay but you won't get the visual benefits since your body fat is on the higher side.

 

[Meetketchup]

I appreciate you, man. The reason to be low already is insulin sensitivity, right? My hope was that I may be on the high side but the metformin nerfs that a bit?

Yes insulin sensitivity amongst other factors. If interested, check out research by Eric Trexler, Greg Nuckols, Mike Israetel, etc regarding P-Ratios, which is what we're talking about.

 

[zionoir626]

Just one new compound per cycle...
It's a suggestion that saves cycles and allows you to learn what compounds do what...
AND
If something goes sideways... It usually points to the New compound...
A Good Rule of thumb..
Z...

 

[JD70]

Looks good to me but if your 1st cycle was awesome at 300mg Test why not just do 400-500 test? Or just add deca or mast and no oral? (or only add the oral to test)? The reason being it'll be noticeably better and give you room to build on future cycles, and you'll know how each drug works/feels. If you do the cycle you wrote you won't know which drugs caused sides, muscle growth, strength

 

[CompoundLifts31]

I tried to overestimate BF for sure, since I feel like everyone just says they’re 8% to sound like a boss.

I’m gonna cruise after, so no PCT. Planning to go 16 weeks as long as I’m feeling good and pulling decent bloods. AI’s on hand. I guess I act like I’m fucking around to rep the more casual guys on the board who get a hard time, but I put a lil thought into it.

I have to ask.

What do you mean by the casual members that are given a hard time?

Usually people come in new with a whole slew of misinformation. We help them and give them the best info we can for them personally. Is this what you mean?

The only time I see a new member get bashed is when they ask for advice and then act like an asshole when they don't like the advice they're given.


Sent from my LM-K500 using Tapatalk

 

[zionoir626]

Most of the conflicts I experience,is New Members..
So, I'm backing Off the New Guys personally..
Most try to reinvent the Wheel..
I will however say this.....
The body changes as we age...change points..
40..45..50..and so on...
If you're Not aware or Just don't care..
These changes Will bite you in the Ass..

At 42...
I set all My PR's....
Today... I love to look Back..but I know those numbers will never be challenged..Again..

So.....
If you decide to join this Lifestyle..
Get checked Out..Head to Head..!!
Pull bloods and see exactly where you're markers are at Before.... What your normals are..
Very Important...!!!
Z...

 

[Raekwon]

Looks good to me but if your 1st cycle was awesome at 300mg Test why not just do 400-500 test? Or just add deca or mast and no oral? (or only add the oral to test)? The reason being it'll be noticeably better and give you room to build on future cycles, and you'll know how each drug works/feels. If you do the cycle you wrote you won't know which drugs caused sides, muscle growth, strength

See, this

I have to ask.

What do you mean by the casual members that are given a hard time?

Usually people come in new with a whole slew of misinformation. We help them and give them the best info we can for them personally. Is this what you mean?

The only time I see a new member get bashed is when they ask for advice and then act like an asshole when they don't like the advice they're given.


Sent from my LM-K500 using Tapatalk

i don’t mean “given a hard time” maliciously or anything. I’m here to get educated, and frankly, props to the guys who stick around these boards who already know their shit and are willing to pass it on. Good info on this kinda shit is hard to find.

 

[zionoir626]

See, this

i don’t mean “given a hard time” maliciously or anything. I’m here to get educated, and frankly, props to the guys who stick around these boards who already know their shit and are willing to pass it on. Good info on this kinda shit is hard to find.

Great attitude...
Many of the Vets here...came in the same way you have.. Knowing nearly nothing..
BUT
Some of us were Lucky...
A Vet... Took the needed time to Help.. Educated and Guide..
AND
Passing that Knowledge on...is playing It Forward..

This Forum is more than a bunch of Juice Heads...
A Brotherhood... Solid Friends that Will and Have Helped Many in Times of Need..
I say this First Hand...

Stick around and make some Friends,Learn and Laugh...
Welcome to the Party..!!
Z ..

 

[Raekwon]

Most of the conflicts I experience,is New Members..
So, I'm backing Off the New Guys personally..
Most try to reinvent the Wheel..
I will however say this.....
The body changes as we age...change points..
40..45..50..and so on...
If you're Not aware or Just don't care..
These changes Will bite you in the Ass..

At 42...
I set all My PR's....
Today... I love to look Back..but I know those numbers will never be challenged..Again..

So.....
If you decide to join this Lifestyle..
Get checked Out..Head to Head..!!
Pull bloods and see exactly where you're markers are at Before.... What your normals are..
Very Important...!!!
Z...

For sure, think it’s very easy to dabble in AAS in a vacuum and convince yourself that you know what you’re doing, only to jump on a place like this and realize there are folks who have a shitton more experience and knowledge.

 

[CompoundLifts31]

See, this

i don’t mean “given a hard time” maliciously or anything. I’m here to get educated, and frankly, props to the guys who stick around these boards who already know their shit and are willing to pass it on. Good info on this kinda shit is hard to find.

Hell yeah!! Sorry. I misunderstood that.

Some new guys think we are being dicks when we tell them wait to until you're older to cycle or you only need 500mgs test as your first cycle.

Glad you're here to grow and learn. Everything you need is right at your finger tips.

Welcome home brotha!!!

Sent from my LM-K500 using Tapatalk

 

[zionoir626]

For sure, think it’s very easy to dabble in AAS in a vacuum and convince yourself that you know what you’re doing, only to jump on a place like this and realize there are folks who have a shitton more experience and knowledge.

Sadly, most don't realize how dangerous it can get.. Until, Shit happens..
Trainwreck Threads.. I like to call them..
Research,common sense and patience..goes a long way..
We get all kinds Here...
It's like IFC...
Always On, Slightly OFF...
Z...

 

[Cyborg73]

I mostly lurk here, but appreciate youall. I’m a 43 year old dude who spent 20 of those years as an alcoholic (in recovery for years now), so I’m just glad to be here.

5’11”/210lbs. Not a brick shit house, but you can tell I lift heavy things. Too fat, probably 20% BF.

Anyway, starting my second cycle (first was straight test, 300mg/wk, and it was awesome), and I know I’m pretty sure I’ll get roasted for it, but I’m here for your entertainment:

Each week:
350mg test (sust)
300mg deca
300mg mast

I also use 3ius of HGH/day. Gonna fuck around with 20mg Tbol/day to start and finish. I take NAC and Metformin and all the boring “legal” shit too.

I’m just interested in seeing where this lands feedback-wise. Am I too fat for this cycle? Too much gear? Not a thoughtful combo? Or am I basically about to get all huge and yolked up?

I would increase test to 500mg

 

[Glycomann]

Those aren't crazy doses of gear imo. That being said, your bf of 20%, if accurate, is a little on the high side, but I've seen worse. What's the duration of this cycle, do you have an AI on hand, and what's your plan afterward? Pct off or drop down to a cruise or trt dose?

I didn't choose the swolle life, the swolle life chose me ~ Wesley Swolle

Probably a better choice for him would be to just do a very mild Test/Primo cycle, something like 250 test, 100-150 primo, and diet off about 5-8%, regroup and then do a proper cycle do you think?

 

[littlegainsinmass]

I mostly lurk here, but appreciate youall. I’m a 43 year old dude who spent 20 of those years as an alcoholic (in recovery for years now), so I’m just glad to be here.

5’11”/210lbs. Not a brick shit house, but you can tell I lift heavy things. Too fat, probably 20% BF.

Anyway, starting my second cycle (first was straight test, 300mg/wk, and it was awesome), and I know I’m pretty sure I’ll get roasted for it, but I’m here for your entertainment:

Each week:
350mg test (sust)
300mg deca
300mg mast

I also use 3ius of HGH/day. Gonna fuck around with 20mg Tbol/day to start and finish. I take NAC and Metformin and all the boring “legal” shit too.

I’m just interested in seeing where this lands feedback-wise. Am I too fat for this cycle? Too much gear? Not a thoughtful combo? Or am I basically about to get all huge and yolked up?

I dont see the need for mast. you have to much bf%. I've had great results with Primo. You need to get your bf% down to really reap the benefits of mast. Test deca and primo is a classic stack. t

 

[littlegainsinmass]

Probably a better choice for him would be to just do a very mild Test/Primo cycle, something like 250 test, 100-150 primo, and diet off about 5-8%, regroup and then do a proper cycle do you think?

100% but 100-150 isn't going to do anything imo. primo needs to be run at higher MG. I lost nearly 40lbs doing 250mg test 400mg Primo every 5 days for 16 weeks. I was pinning every 5 days because of pip. I only use glutes so left check 1st then 5 days later the right. it gave me 10 days to heal before the next injection. That's what worked for me. pinning every 4 days would be ideal but you can draw it out to 5 and still have enough primo by that 4-5th day.

 

[littlegainsinmass]

I would increase test to 500mg

running test at 500 maybe way to high. he needs blood work before during and after. I know doing 500mg of test every 10 days my level was 1800 or so. I see no benefits to having such high levels unless your E2 is shit.

 

[Glycomann]

100% but 100-150 isn't going to do anything imo. primo needs to be run at higher MG. I lost nearly 40lbs doing 250mg test 400mg Primo every 5 days for 16 weeks. I was pinning every 5 days because of pip. I only use glutes so left check 1st then 5 days later the right. it gave me 10 days to heal before the next injection. That's what worked for me. pinning every 4 days would be ideal but you can draw it out to 5 and still have enough primo by that 4-5th day.

"needs to be is too strong". That ratio test/primo would kill my estrogen, make my joints ache and leave me flat. I have cut on 100 mg test C and 75 mg primo. I guess it depends on who you are and how you cut. At the end of that cut I was a true 10% at 195 lbs at 5'8". Some of you guys like to cut to reported is 6%. That's extreme and I don't think that is what we are talking about here. A generous TRT and a little Primo for partitioning and estrogen control is all I need. 200 Test C and 100 primo is plenty for me but at my age I am conservative. but Hey, I can cut like that, take a quick 100 mg TRT or go off for a month, get good blood work results, and then do a proper cycle and not start off toxic. That's always a concern for me.

 

[Meetketchup]

If I hear another "run test at 500mg" for someone in the beginning stages of cycling...

 

[Cyborg73]

If I hear another "run test at 500mg" for someone in the beginning stages of cycling...

Funny how all this guy's these days carry on saying 500 is to high. I been around 20 yrs plus and back when I first started 500mg was normal.

 

[Worldcat255]

I mostly lurk here, but appreciate youall. I’m a 43 year old dude who spent 20 of those years as an alcoholic (in recovery for years now), so I’m just glad to be here.

5’11”/210lbs. Not a brick shit house, but you can tell I lift heavy things. Too fat, probably 20% BF.

Anyway, starting my second cycle (first was straight test, 300mg/wk, and it was awesome), and I know I’m pretty sure I’ll get roasted for it, but I’m here for your entertainment:

Each week:
350mg test (sust)
300mg deca
300mg mast

I also use 3ius of HGH/day. Gonna fuck around with 20mg Tbol/day to start and finish. I take NAC and Metformin and all the boring “legal” shit too.

I’m just interested in seeing where this lands feedback-wise. Am I too fat for this cycle? Too much gear? Not a thoughtful combo? Or am I basically about to get all huge and yolked up?

How long have you been running the 3ius of HGH?

 

[rawbuilt]

950mg of gear on your second cycle

thats unnecessary

 

[Meetketchup]

Funny how all this guy's these days carry on saying 500 is to high. I been around 20 yrs plus and back when I first started 500mg was normal.

"Guys these days?" I'm 46.

I'm referring to the old school blanket recommendation of 500mg for a first or 2nd cycle as gospel. It's not. "Most" people don't need to run test that high when first starting out. People can run 200-400mg and get very similar results, while leaving plenty of room for higher dosages down the road with less sides. The literature on anabolics has come a long way in 20 years.

 

[Raekwon]

I guess to OP owes and update. I started about 500mg Test/wk after the first set of responses came and we’ll see how that goes. Honestly, I’m more tired, but hopefully that’s because I’m going harder in the gym. Really appreciate all the advice and wisdom of the group to talk me off the ledge. Lol. Great resources to learn from.

 

[Raekwon]

How long have you been running the 3ius of HGH?

About 3 months now. Not really a “bodybuilding” dose, but I hope it helps me to lean out and live forever and whatnot.

 

[Glycomann]

Funny how all this guy's these days carry on saying 500 is to high. I been around 20 yrs plus and back when I first started 500mg was normal.

And 35 years ago when I started test in any cycle was rare. Deca was the base, and dianabol was the test substitute although we had no idea that was what it was doing at the time. A tryical cycle was 1-2 little vials of deca and 4 or 5 5 mg dianabol a day and most of us put on 25 lbs in a cycle. 500 mg of test back then left us bloated and red faced, not the look we ere looking for. Things change i guess. Now 500 mg with estrogen control is probably fine if you can manage it. It you're a low estrogen converter even better.