Advise, criticism, goals.

[TheRealBull]

This may be slightly out of context considering I have already posted a topic for insight on a beginner cycle. With that being said I’d like to give somewhat of a back story/ day in the life of me in hopes for some real advise/constructive criticism.

I’m 27, currently 6’2 weighing in around 165. I’m obviously a hard gainer and an extreme ectomorph. Been training for 3 years but didn’t necessarily get extremely serious with it until the past few months which is where I’ve made most of my gains. Roughly 20 pounds in the last 3 months, picture attached.

A normal day for me would contain breakfast, typically 4 eggs some days I’ll add a meat but generally just eggs. I’ll take a mass gainer shake around mid morning (450 calories 35g protein) lunch time I’ll usually eat a solid meat and 3 veggies, usually some peanut butter throughout the afternoon to satisfy hunger, dinner that evening typically chicken and rice or beef and rice followed with some more peanut butter b4 bed time. I take bcaas and creatine daily, train 3-5 days a week on the weeks I can go 5 I’ll re work my legs and chest since they are my weak point. No my diet is not perfect. I do have generally 2 meals a week that I’ll cheat on. I drink at least a gallon of water a day. Rarely have any other drinks maybe a Red Bull here and there in the mornings.

I posted a thread a while back about running my first cycle and have somewhat decided on cyp only. I know this will not be some miracle thing for me especially if I don’t eat right and train hard. Really just looking for some solid knowledge from some experienced people. My goal would be to get myself around 180-190 solid, I would rather keep a somewhat lean physique.

This picture attached was 3 months ago and now 145-165

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[GarlicChicken]

Firstly, fucking A on putting your shit out there for people to criticise. That will get you help around here man. You've done some solid work thus far!

As far as your current shape, you're in great shape to start putting on more mass. Lean is good, it allows you to push more food without getting fat and you'll keep your metabolism ripping.

Now, the number one thing that's going to put in the size is food. Your diet is clean, which is awesome. But now it's time to start increasing your calories.

At your current shape, I would keep your protein intake around 250g daily, mostly from animal proteins. Eggs/whites, chicken, turkey, lean beef, cottage cheese, Fage yogurt are my sources.

Then add carbs to each meal, except maybe just before bed. I would say somewhere around 50g per meal 5x daily to start. That's one cup of rice, 200g sweet potato, 10oz white potato, 2 packs of flavored oats.

Now you NEED fats to grow. This is very important. Peanut butter, Mac nut oil, evoo, almonds, animal fats from beef are go to sources. The higher you push your calories, the more you'll find that oils are great because you can increase calories significantly without as much chewing and satiety lol.

I'm happy to send you my base diet for adding size. I'm sitting at 5'7" and 200 right now at around 18%, so we should be around the same amount of lean mass. I started as what I thought was a hardgainer, but I've found over the years that my training style greatly influenced that. I started lifting at 121lbs and fat...my best has been 188 at around 8%. Obviously that did take gear, but I got up to about 160 naturally under 12%.

 

[hot rod]

dude, u r one of those guys that can eat 6 meals a day and get nothing but a little pooch belly and that goes away right after your morning shit. man,u remind me of a guy I used to work out with. all this dude wanted was a chest. we would do virtually the exact same workout and I had a 45 in. chest and he had like a 36 in. chest. some of this shit is genetic. let me make one thing clear, im not saying u cant make gains,because u can. I totally agree with garlic on the diet. u need more complex carbs. and of course more fat.(but the right kind). I think u can make a lot more natural gains. having said that, I also think u would benefit from a test. only cycle and the right diet (back to garlic). the guy im talking about did a cycle and gained 22 lbs.(this was 30 years ago and he did test.,d-bol and var., which most guys on here would say that's a fucked up cycle, but its what the crooked dr. gave us.) I gained 30 lbs. and looked like someone blew me up with an air hose.Anyway I know there will be a lot of guys that tell u to wait, but I doubt u will. so good luck and let us know how u r doing

 

[zionoir626]

This is my newest forum friend and he is exactly where a great deal of us used to be........Small,new to the gear,lifestyle and needing our help...So, as a favor to me ........help him,do what we do best.............give life experiences that will open his eyes and guild him...Give him a nice welcome and kudos for the guts to put it out there...Point him to what he needs to know ,learn and research......Thanks Guys

 

[Bigjape34]

Love the way you structure this post man can’t wait to see where you take your diet and training !!!!


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[heavyhitter]

First things first, you flat out need more food. Especially protein and healthy fats. Second....drop the bcaas in favor of eaas or whey protein. As for gear.../I firmly believe everyone’s first cycle should be test only. 400-500 mgs a week would be a good place to start

 

[HFO3]

Welcome to ASF
Track your macros with an app, like” lose it! “
What AAS are you using?


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[GarlicChicken]

I'll also publicly post some of my unpopular opinions lol.

Firstly, I highly suggest getting your total T levels checked before you pull the trigger on gear. That way you know where you're at before you start because like I said in pm...it might not come back very well.

If it were me doing my first cycle again, here's what I would do:

16 weeks of 500mg test E or C
Last 8 weeks 25mg dbol, and ramping up to maybe 35-40mg daily the last couple weeks
-or-
50mg anavar for the last 6-8 weeks
Aromasin as required

I say lower dbol for longer duration because it has less sides and better muscle retention vs a shorter blast with higher doses. I also recommend towards the end because of the cell maturation properties the dbol or anavar have. Anavar obviously has less difficult side effects like e2 increases, but is a good bit harder on the lipids. Dbol is better for putting on size though.

Essential to have nolva on hand in case you start developing gyno.

 

[TheRealBull]

Welcome to ASF
Track your macros with an app, like” lose it! “
What AAS are you using?


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I’m not on anything currently, my plan was to run a test cyp only cycle for 12 weeks and then PCT off with clomid and nova


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[Milford King]

Peanut butter is miracle grow for skinny guys. Eat a lot of it. 4000+ calories in a 28oz (793g) jar of jif.

back when I had a metabolism and was a natural lifter, if I had to make weight for a tournament I’d eat half/full jar of PB and tons of spaghetti.

 

[HFO3]

I’m not on anything currently, my plan was to run a test cyp only cycle for 12 weeks and then PCT off with clomid and nova


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12 week cycle at 500mgs a week is my recomendo I can’t stress enough how important it is in the beginning to know your macros FIRST, track them so you can adjust them according to your goals.




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[Vision]

Welcome to ASF
Track your macros with an app, like” lose it! “
What AAS are you using?


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welcome to the community.. it takes a lot of guts to make a thread like this, kudos to you, and I hope you can take something away from this and learn.

the app that was suggested by HFO is actually a very good application.. it's very user-friendly..

also I would focus on getting more dense calories and I would ditch any Mass gainer shakes, and just replace that with real whole food.. you should restructure your entire schedule and just focus on eating.. right now you should be literally obsessing over consuming food..

 

[zionoir626]

Should have named this thread........Project 2020.................At 27 ,,pretty humble ,driven and hungry..........

 

[Milford King]

Dude would make a killer log for the skinny newbs to learn from.

have we ever had a ‘first time user log’.

bet sponsors would jump in that as those gains will be the best gains of your life...

 

[Bigjape34]

Dude would make a killer log for the skinny newbs to learn from.

have we ever had a ‘first time user log’.

bet sponsors would jump in that as those gains will be the best gains of your life...

That’s a great idea... I think it would be great for him to log this journey especially is he’s derailed we can provide him with whatever advice/ knowledge we have and your deff right milf this could be a good starting block for any new individuals looking to go to the dark side haha


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[Vision]

Dude would make a killer log for the skinny newbs to learn from.

have we ever had a ‘first time user log’.

bet sponsors would jump in that as those gains will be the best gains of your life...

I already presented him with the opportunity right after he posted
Team PSL is willing to assist him, at the same time with the rest of the community contributing to feed him knowledge and watch him grow. it would be educational for many people like him, at the same time it could give us members hear some good material to view

 

[HFO3]

A great way to start your day ....6oz chicken. 1/4 cup almonds. 1/2 avocado. 1.5 cups strawberries
Eat plenty of almonds, avocados, wheat pasta.

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[GarlicChicken]

Dude would make a killer log for the skinny newbs to learn from.

have we ever had a ‘first time user log’.

bet sponsors would jump in that as those gains will be the best gains of your life...

Agreed. He would get a ton of advice and probably make obnoxious gains. A guy I just helped through his first gained 42lbs. Of course he's genetically gifted but that was still amazing

 

[Bigjape34]

I already presented him with the opportunity right after he posted
Team PSL is willing to assist him, at the same time with the rest of the community contributing to feed him knowledge and watch him grow. it would be educational for many people like him, at the same time it could give us members hear some good material to view

Very generous vision hope he takes you guys up on your offer I think this would be awesome


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[GarlicChicken]

I already presented him with the opportunity right after he posted
Team PSL is willing to assist him, at the same time with the rest of the community contributing to feed him knowledge and watch him grow. it would be educational for many people like him, at the same time it could give us members hear some good material to view

Hell yeah man. I'd be happy to help him on diet and stuff. Training too. I don't have a lot of time to give up but I'd be willing to give what I have

 

[malfeasance]

A normal day for me would contain breakfast, typically 4 eggs some days I’ll add a meat but generally just eggs.

Add two more eggs (6). Over time, build up to two more than that (8). Add half cup (measured dry) of Quaker Old Fashioned Oatmeal. Work up to full cup. Slice of whole grain toast.

I’ll take a mass gainer shake around mid morning (450 calories 35g protein)

Eh, better than nothing, I guess. Not really a meal.

lunch time I’ll usually eat a solid meat and 3 veggies

8 ounces (that's half a pound, buy a kitchen scale, they are cheap) of meat. Add a carb. It can be rice, it can be potato, it can be sweet potato.

usually some peanut butter throughout the afternoon to satisfy hunger

So you are hungry? Good! Add another meal just like the one above. 8 ounces meat, carb, veggie.

dinner that evening typically chicken and rice or beef and rice

Good contents, but you don't say how much. 8 ounces meat, at least a cup of rice (roughly 200-250 grams).

followed with some more peanut butter b4 bed time.

Follow it with another meal at bedtime. Make it smaller for a while if you have trouble getting it in.

Track what you are eating and drinking on MyFitnessPal, so you really know your macros and are not just guessing.

Just to recap, shoot for 6-8 eggs and two pounds of meat (spread out over approx. 4 meals) with adequate carb sources.

 

[malfeasance]

A great way to start your day ....6oz chicken. 1/4 cup almonds. 1/2 avocado. 1.5 cups strawberries
Eat plenty of almonds, avocados, wheat pasta.

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Wow, that looks really good.

 

[Vision]

Wow, that looks really good.

man, you got to see some of the meals he whips up..
they are amazing.. they look like the type of platters I see in magazines...

 

[GarlicChicken]

What are you doing for training Bull? Have you been lifting consistently for those 3 years?

 

[HFO3]

After you have trained, eat a banana and a small 25 gram whey shake... then enjoy a nice dense meal like this one I just ate a chicken cordon bleu and a hefty slice of lasagna with 2 pieces garlic bread

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[Vision]

After you have trained, eat a banana and a small 25 gram whey shake... then enjoy a nice dense meal like this one I just ate a chicken cordon bleu and a hefty slice of lasagna with 2 pieces garlic bread

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no fuss no muss..
its that simple.. dense calories, real whole food, and no mass gainer.. and the meal portions don't have to be huge they just have to be consistent!

 

[TheRealBull]

What are you doing for training Bull? Have you been lifting consistently for those 3 years?

I’ve been going super hard the past 3 months, over the past 3 years it’s been sporadic and honestly a waste of time. Would be serious for a month or two and then get lazy. Generally I’ll either train chest/arms/back and shoulders/ legs or I’ll do chest and triceps, back and biceps, shoulders and legs. I incorporate core on every gym day in some fashion. Generally train pyramid or reverse pyramid style, some days mainly free weights some days mainly machines I really try and keep my muscles guessing though.


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[Montego]

It's pretty simple for a TRUE "hard gainer".

Get you needed proteins.

Eat just about anything else you want until you're about to puke. Wait three hours, do it again.

Don't train more then four days a week, those should be focused on progressive overload for heavy compound movements.

Don't do any cardio.

Sleep more.

Then, eat more.

 

[Vision]

I’ve been going super hard the past 3 months, over the past 3 years it’s been sporadic and honestly a waste of time. Would be serious for a month or two and then get lazy. Generally I’ll either train chest/arms/back and shoulders/ legs or I’ll do chest and triceps, back and biceps, shoulders and legs. I incorporate core on every gym day in some fashion. Generally train pyramid or reverse pyramid style, some days mainly free weights some days mainly machines I really try and keep my muscles guessing though.


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if you are not eating enough and your training that aggressively you're going to go nowhere.. it sounds like you're under eating and overtraining, that is the brick wall that you're hitting..
you need to make adjustments in both directions.. dial the training back a little bit on your training, and increase your food by a lot.. hitting certain muscle groups frequently does work for some, but people like that are meeting it right down the middle with their macros and rest..

 

[TripleOvertime]

Nicely done team ASF. This is what forums is all about. Its not everyday a new guy gets this much support right off the bat from this many forum vets.

To the original poster. All these guys obviously see something in you that they feel is worth their time to help with. Take that and run with it man. Accept the help, learn from the dozens of years of combined knowledge that is being thrown to you. Start that log, accept those psl products and make truly life changing progress. The ball is in your hands now. Make it worth our time and effort and we can assist you to be where you want to be.