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Stop lying to yourself

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  1. #16
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    I was literally having this conversation today with a doctor.

    A matter of fact we were even talking about TRT and PED use.. Even TRT is not as safe as we would like it to be. Just because clinics are popping up all over the place that doesn't mean it's for everyone although it has been a medical treatment for decades now, but it literally is not for everyone because if that was the case literally everyone would be on TRT, and I don't need anyone saying "welp, everyone already is".. because the reality is that doctors are not always making it a go to resort, majority of the cases it's at the patient's request and doctors tried to educate their clients on the potentials and possibilities with health-related issues.. most cases are referrals from a primary physician, and some primary physicians prescribe it, and others go to a clinic that caters around it with a keen observation.

    The truth is, our kidneys, lungs/heart (cardiovascular system) and hormones decline as we get older, we are simply aging it is biological, there's a reason why hormones also drop off as well.. it's the due process of life and it's totally natural.. (I'm not talkin about people having an underlying condition needing TRT from an earlier starting point).

    TRT and PED use will catch up to everyone at some point, there's going to be a trade-off and no one is impervious.

    It's risk vs reward.. and what are we willing to sacrifice and trade.

    Considering the environment that I'm in I'm going to make a very unpopular statement but it's the unvarnished truth, PED's can be potentially dangerous. User beware and own it!!!

  2. #17
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    This is a very serious matter. Most guys will start young thinking they are invincible. Only to eventually find out that their hormones will never be the same, and that coming off of T isnít an option. In my humble opinion, I believe staying on a normal medical dose of testosterone long term is just what it is. However when you have the guys who choose to run 500mg+ year round alongside various AAS, I think thatís where the medical risks come into play.

    In addition to the above statement, the other detrimental factors in users lives play a part... shitty diet, external drug abuse, genetic illnesses, etc.... the medical side of this game is very real. I think itís mainly a question of ďwhenĒ said user will run into these issues. For example, Matt porter recently. May god rest his soul.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vision View Post
    I was literally having this conversation today with a doctor.

    A matter of fact we were even talking about TRT and PED use.. Even TRT is not as safe as we would like it to be. Just because clinics are popping up all over the place that doesn't mean it's for everyone although it has been a medical treatment for decades now, but it literally is not for everyone because if that was the case literally everyone would be on TRT, and I don't need anyone saying "welp, everyone already is".. because the reality is that doctors are not always making it a go to resort, majority of the cases it's at the patient's request and doctors tried to educate their clients on the potentials and possibilities with health-related issues.. most cases are referrals from a primary physician, and some primary physicians prescribe it, and others go to a clinic that caters around it with a keen observation.

    The truth is, our kidneys, lungs/heart (cardiovascular system) and hormones decline as we get older, we are simply aging it is biological, there's a reason why hormones also drop off as well.. it's the due process of life and it's totally natural.. (I'm not talkin about people having an underlying condition needing TRT from an earlier starting point).

    TRT and PED use will catch up to everyone at some point, there's going to be a trade-off and no one is impervious.

    It's risk vs reward.. and what are we willing to sacrifice and trade.

    Considering the environment that I'm in I'm going to make a very unpopular statement but it's the unvarnished truth, PED's can be potentially dangerous. User beware and own it!!!
    I don't think that would be considered an unpopular statement at all.

    I think the community being open and truthful about the risk is a step towards having more conversations about preventative measures and harm reduction. Only good can come of that
    .

  4. #19
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    I have made it a rule to pretty much stay away from high doses and orals.

    Also, I started late. Around 42 years old.

    So, I haven't been doing this "long term" the way others might be...

    My reason for staying on is the fucking PCT. Takes me about 8 weeks to really get back to any normalcy.

  5. #20
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    Been thinking about this a lot lately. My recreational AAS use is pure vanity and I know it. Itís something I enjoy and I feel like it benefits my mood but really it has done nothing for me(besides muscle growth and increased confidence) been beat down with injuries so I donít know how much longer Iím gonna be doing this. I at least need to take a few years off. I donít know man. Iím a low dose kinda guy but I get freaked out about my future a lot.

    Im back and forth, constantly beating myself up over this conundrum.


    to poke or not to poke? That is the question....

  6. #21
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    Fear not! now run along and bury a 3cc barrel of test in your ass

  7. #22
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    Not much to contribute as of now, just reading the responses and soaking in all the harsh realities.

    Thank you for your post Monte, and to all who contributed. It's something we try not to think about, but the truth is we should.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

  8. #23
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    One of the top TRT docs in the country has dozens and dozens of guys running 400/test/week and they are very healthy. With good labs. After the age of 50 he recommends 350/week. We discussed this at length the other day. My script is for 350. I am older. He was writing a script for a client for more. He has more than 80 publications on the topic. He is one of a few that know what they are doing.

    Granted, a lot of docs are incredibly dumb. My ex fiancť' (and 2 e girl friends) loved their patients, but they used hard work and got breaks. Their science was mediocre.

    Believe what you want, I will stick with the science. You need detailed analysis of extensive labs to really know. I test everything....everything, full kidney liver. Dropping $4k (my insurance covered 2.5....it was worth it) on a cardiologist was money well spent.

    Most of what we think we know is driven by opinion, histrionic mass media, and conjecture. Don right, steroids can be safe.

    Now, competitors are running insane amounts. 3, 4, 5 grams and more. Other people also abuse (and don't even look good). Train naturally until your 30's, use wisely, and you can be healthy.

  9. #24
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    One other thing.....if you use, everything, everything in your life must focus upon training eating, and recovery. No clubs, no drinking, no recs, no painkillers. Sleep, food, work (as long as you earn) EVERYTHING!

    Social life is gym, family, and close friends. If something gets in the way, it is out of my life.
    Last edited by Procard; 06-19-2019 at 06:04 PM.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Procard View Post
    One other thing.....if you use, everything, everything in your life must focus upon training eating, and recovery. No clubs, no drinking, no recs, no painkillers. Sleep, food, work (as long as you earn) EVERYTHING!

    Social life is gym, family, and close friends.
    Where I come from there is no such thing as good friends. Everyone has their own interests in mind, and anyone not involved in the gym life are heavy drinkers, drug users, and backstabbers. (Just my own experiences lol) Family is key

    I agree on everything you said, I know far too many AAS users who dabble into far too much shit they have no business dabbling in. Great points procard

  11. #26
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    All the guys I know/work with/hang with are all very strong family men, especially the martial art guys. They all work, have family time, yet want to spend an hour and a half on the mat and another hour lifting every day. I am constantly fighting with them to take a day off.

    They need the gear in order for their body to handle the training volume and are almost all over 35. There is no way they could continue their lifestyle w/out it.

  12. #27
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    [QUOTE=Vision;1525569]

    "Ped's can be very dangerous..." So says the man with tren in his avatar, LOL

  13. #28
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    [QUOTE=Procard;1525629]
    Quote Originally Posted by Vision View Post

    "Ped's can be very dangerous..." So says the man with tren in his avatar, LOL
    Your point is?

  14. #29
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    Yolo

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    I recently read an article that suggested that long term AAS users possibly even at moderate doses had a higher rate of hardened arteries than non users. If this is so, or even if it is something to consider, which blood test do you do to watch for that?




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