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The higher the dosages of anabolics the biggest you get?

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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by ItalianMuscle View Post
    Go re read your post, you said guys that eat over 7K are fat, I proved you wrong. I might as well prove you wrong again.
    Joey Chestnut and Takeru Kobayashi and Matt Stonie worlds best competitive eaters eat well over 10K calories. Joey ate 74 hotdogs, 22000+ calories. He isn't really fat or obese. He weighs 230 and stands at 6'1". If you want to consider eating a sport as well like these guys do.

    Takeru Kobayashi has abs eating 6K calories...lol


    https://www.joe.co.uk/fitness-health...n-one-go-77322
    Yes, re-read my post and the quoted text above it. 🤦*♂️ Then it will hopefully all make sense you.

    I was going to explain, but you seem like you could use a "win", so I'll just let you have that one.

  2. #32
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    This is a dangerous road to go down.

    but Genetics is everything. As you can see from plenty of individuals on this forum. They take way more gear than I do..... but do they honestly look like it? Not trying to be rude, just being real, giving you the best real example I can.
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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by ItalianMuscle View Post
    Go re read your post, you said guys that eat over 7K are fat, I proved you wrong. I might as well prove you wrong again.
    Joey Chestnut and Takeru Kobayashi and Matt Stonie worlds best competitive eaters eat well over 10K calories. Joey ate 74 hotdogs, 22000+ calories. He isn't really fat or obese. He weighs 230 and stands at 6'1". If you want to consider eating a sport as well like these guys do.

    Takeru Kobayashi has abs eating 6K calories...lol


    https://www.joe.co.uk/fitness-health...n-one-go-77322

    This is a flawed and invalid argument. Alot of competitive eaters use romaine lettuce to stretch out their stomach, when they do consume an absurd amount of calories they'll usually throw it up afterwards...and most importantly. THEY DONT EAT THAT MUCH CONSISTENTLEY EVERYDAY.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by CoachCabo View Post
    First I agree with your first response. Now this awesome sarcasm. Nice!

    I logged back on to respond to this thread specifically.

    MONSTRO seems to be the new hero here. I like he is contributing so much and a lot of it helpful information, but I hope members are reading between the lines on his post, or at least adding them up and deciding what is good and what isnít.

    Perhaps top level bidybuilders are using these crazy number and dosages but many think the bodybuilders today, while definitely bigger across the board, donít have the refined physiques of the 80s and 90s. The info MONSTRO is getting from these guys may bet correct but I know for a fact what some Olympians were using in 1989. How do I know this? Because before these guys were celebrities in the instagram and youtube age, they were broke fuckers who slept at my friends houses in San Diego because they didnít have enough money for hotals. I got them into my local gyms for free as guests and even gave one guy gas money so he could get back to LA.
    We talked openly about steroids because they werenít really controlled at the time. They told me of a couple of guys who used crazy amounts (for the time) and it was the subject of amazement and laughter.

    The guys I knew used around a gram of test...maybe, 2 amps of parabolan (maybe 3) and never went over 150mg of anadrol or 75mg of dbol.
    Pre-contest that array switched to winstrol, anavar and two weeks of 20mg halotestin. The only anti-estrogen they used was 10mg of nolvadex.

    I could list names of these guys but it would serve no purpose and I would sound like every other name dropper.

    Seeing this ridiculously high dosing being promulgated here is exactly why I wonít contribute anymore.
    Methinks the rational guys on the forum just skip over this shit these days.
    I do not know what pro show was in San Diego in 1989, but bodybuilding in the 1980s was much different from bodybuilding in 2020. All the Mr. Olympias in the 1980s were below 200 pounds except Lee Haney, who brought a new size standard to the stage with his big lat wings. Even so, in 1989 Lee Haney weighed in at 243 pounds. Nobody else on stage was like him. In fact, the second place winner was Lee Labrada. What did he weigh? 180?

    Here is Lee Haney weighing in on video for 1989.



    The Arnold Sports Festival claims Brandon Curry weighs 260. He is short - only 5'7" (Lee Haney was 5'11" - a full third of a foot taller).

    Then look at the list of other competitors qualified for the Olympia, like James Hollingshead and Roelly Winklaar and, well, Phil Heath, and take note of the vast differences between the 1980s and today.

    Could it all be better genetics in 2020?

    I doubt it. Increased doses and increased growth hormone and insulin. <----- Just my two cents.

    Guys like Monstro have to compete in this field and have to do well to make money.

    Your typical poster here has no reason to be pushing things like the pros do, so I am 100% with you if that is your point, but I sincerely doubt the 2020 lineup is doing what your acquaintances in 1989 (who were financially broken) shared with you while crashed at your place. The typical poster here probably has no business doing "a gram of test...maybe, 2 amps of parabolan (maybe 3) and . . . 150mg of anadrol or 75mg of dbol. Pre-contest that array switched to winstrol, anavar and two weeks of 20mg halotestin." Either.

    But the question was asked in the original post and the title of this thread.

    Let's face it. There is a size-dose relationship.

    300mg a week of testosterone and 600 - which will support more size? There is an actual study on that one, by the way, and 600 wins, with no controlled diet and no working out.

    Would 800 be better? No way to know, because no study has ever been done higher than 600mg.

    But the reality is that every time I try something new or push dosages a little higher, I get a little bigger and better. The only thing stopping me from continuing down that road is concern for my health, and, let's face it, at my age there is no real point to it, since it would be impossible for me to be a pro bodybuilder AND I doubt I had the genetics for it even when I was younger (but we'll never know, as that window closed a long time ago).

    So, yeah, genetics matter, yeah, diet matters (duh), training matters, but gear matters, and we should not pretend it does not.

    Without hormones many of us would be cutting down to 5% body fat and weighing 135-140, maybe 160 if taller and 180 if some sort of genetic freak (and tall). <---- and that's a fact.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by MONSTRO View Post
    We can see that in medicinal view . Anadrol is used in medicine to treat anemia and when the pacient begin using it they gain alot of weight even eating the same food . We have medical tests with people using steroids as medical instructions and is muscle mass improves alot even without training .
    I had a diet given to me by a bodybuilder who listened and helped me design it based on my goals. It was to be used for my first cycle.

    I started my very first bodybuilding diet BEFORE my first cycle. Why not? I had it, and I did not yet have the steroids. So I made a decision to implement it and see how it worked natty. It DID work. I gained a few pounds. I got a tad bit leaner. Keep in mind I had no idea about diet before I tried the bodybuilding diet, I just ate and ate and tried to eat a lot of meat and peanut butter and milk (LOL!), so it is no surprise that the new diet worked.

    But I did stall after gaining just a few pounds.


    After a couple of weeks stalled I broke out the stash I had been collecting and hoarding for my first cycle. Do we all remember that nervous, shaking first syringe filling, first time puncturing the skin so slowly, just sure we were going to get an infection or break off the needle under the skin or send an air bubble to our brain and die? LOL!

    Ten weeks later, 25 pounds heavier, stronger, looking completely different if watery (didn't know about "watery" at the time).

    A month or so later after the water weight dropped off, realizing you were still 12 pounds up and looked so different as not to be recognizable from your former physique. I had gained muscle and gotten a bunch leaner.

    Guess what? SAME diet all the way through, with no variation. Boring but consistent.

    Same workout, too.

    The only difference was the hormones.

    Of course, this example was a first cycle and lower than some guys cruise on! But it illustrates that hormones certainly do make a difference. Do any of us think if our wife eats more, her arms and shoulders will look like ours? Why not? Hormones, that's why not. Give her testosterone and watch that change (yuck, but you get the point).

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by malfeasance View Post
    I had a diet given to me by a bodybuilder who listened and helped me design it based on my goals. It was to be used for my first cycle.

    I started my very first bodybuilding diet BEFORE my first cycle. Why not? I had it, and I did not yet have the steroids. So I made a decision to implement it and see how it worked natty. It DID work. I gained a few pounds. I got a tad bit leaner. Keep in mind I had no idea about diet before I tried the bodybuilding diet, I just ate and ate and tried to eat a lot of meat and peanut butter and milk (LOL!), so it is no surprise that the new diet worked.

    But I did stall after gaining just a few pounds.


    After a couple of weeks stalled I broke out the stash I had been collecting and hoarding for my first cycle. Do we all remember that nervous, shaking first syringe filling, first time puncturing the skin so slowly, just sure we were going to get an infection or break off the needle under the skin or send an air bubble to our brain and die? LOL!

    Ten weeks later, 25 pounds heavier, stronger, looking completely different if watery (didn't know about "watery" at the time).

    A month or so later after the water weight dropped off, realizing you were still 12 pounds up and looked so different as not to be recognizable from your former physique. I had gained muscle and gotten a bunch leaner.

    Guess what? SAME diet all the way through, with no variation. Boring but consistent.

    Same workout, too.

    The only difference was the hormones.

    Of course, this example was a first cycle and lower than some guys cruise on! But it illustrates that hormones certainly do make a difference. Do any of us think if our wife eats more, her arms and shoulders will look like ours? Why not? Hormones, that's why not. Give her testosterone and watch that change (yuck, but you get the point).

    Great post. 100% spot on.

    Transport Lee Haney from the 80's to today and give him the gear protocols of the Heath's, Curry's, etc as well as all the other supplements his heart desires and Mr. Haney would be a bigger bodybuilder than he was back in the 80's. No question.

  7. #37
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    malfeasance you just said all . Our biggest concern is the health and of course the money used ( not for all) and only make sense if you earn money doing bodybuilding, if not stay low dosages and keep healthy

  8. #38
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    1st I can't believe Skip and i agree..the danger in this thread is the New guy..all he sees is more is better..I posted on a different thread the dangers of long cycles..but was shrugged..fine run them if you want..just remember to come back and post when it hits the fan..Same here.. I'm 54 and have a list of problems due to prolonged use..at low to moderate doses..So,you think higher doses will yield less??..that old"if everything is equal"..well it never is or will be..
    The 80 to 90% of us never will step on stage and pose..the largest part of us are just regular working class guys that want to be bigger,stronger or whatever..and are here to learn and share..any of us that have been here for anything more than a couple of years see all kinds of plain stupid stuff..the majority of threads are from New guys that want to re-invent the wheel..1st cycle Tren..we have all seen those threads..with all the info at the touch of fingers,but still want to be spoon feed..
    Lastly...more is not better..find what works for you..risk vs reward..

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by zionoir626 View Post
    1st I can't believe Skip and i agree..the danger in this thread is the New guy..all he sees is more is better..I posted on a different thread the dangers of long cycles..but was shrugged..fine run them if you want..just remember to come back and post when it hits the fan..Same here.. I'm 54 and have a list of problems due to prolonged use..at low to moderate doses..So,you think higher doses will yield less??..that old"if everything is equal"..well it never is or will be..
    The 80 to 90% of us never will step on stage and pose..the largest part of us are just regular working class guys that want to be bigger,stronger or whatever..and are here to learn and share..any of us that have been here for anything more than a couple of years see all kinds of plain stupid stuff..the majority of threads are from New guys that want to re-invent the wheel..1st cycle Tren..we have all seen those threads..with all the info at the touch of fingers,but still want to be spoon feed..
    Lastly...more is not better..find what works for you..risk vs reward..
    I agree with what you say. I think the distinction Monstro is making, though, is that if you earn a living from bodybuilding type pursuits, and if gear helps you in those pursuits, well, you can do so but it is sure as hell risky and it is on YOU to be aware of those risks. If a newbie or anyone on these boards, just a general gym rat, thinks taking pro-level gear dosing is a good idea or something to consider, well, best of luck to them as it is NOT a good idea. The fact I even have to say that is absurd.

    Monstro, given the language difference/barrier, is perhaps simply missing a bit nuance. But Monstro, I think your English (not being your primary language) is quite good.

    Me, personally, I take an interested voyeur approach to the world Monstro lives in and what the pros do. I will never live that life or take those gear protocols myself, but I find it interesting.
    Last edited by christiantt; 11-27-2020 at 11:32 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by anabolichow2 View Post
    This is a dangerous road to go down.

    but Genetics is everything. As you can see from plenty of individuals on this forum. They take way more gear than I do..... but do they honestly look like it? Not trying to be rude, just being real, giving you the best real example I can.
    You clearly have atleast "good" genetics for mass.

    But i think Monstro's point is that say you had a twin brother with identical genetics for muscle building, you both trained together with the same intensity, load, volume etc and ate the same quality 5000 cals per day, high protein diet.

    Picture that for a moment...

    The ONLY difference is that you are on one gram of gear and your twin is taking 3 grams of multiple compounds.

    Who will be healthier after 3 years? Probably you, lol, but that's not the point... This is bodybuilding, not men's health...

    Who would have gained more lean mass and strength? Same calories, same training style/intensity, same rest, etc, just different doses...?

    And of course at a certain point the twin using more gear would surpass the other in loads used...i realize that.
    Last edited by ArgonCoagulator; 11-27-2020 at 12:50 PM.

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    Lets be clear . this is something to show all the beginners this is not the way to do it because you will destroy your health and your bank account.
    And another think : even the pros begin using low dosages and increase them with time and mass you get , the more muscle you have the more anabolics you need to keep that mass ( thats why pros use high dosages , because they weight over 250lb with 5% fat )
    Of course when you achieve some level the only think you can increase is anabolics , because after 7k calories is not possible to eat more day by day , you cant sleep more than 10 hours because you need time to eat, drink water and train, if you train more you will not recover and you get catabolic . ITS SIMPLE AS THAT / Just stop and think

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by zionoir626 View Post
    1st I can't believe Skip and i agree..the danger in this thread is the New guy..all he sees is more is better..I posted on a different thread the dangers of long cycles..but was shrugged..fine run them if you want..just remember to come back and post when it hits the fan..Same here.. I'm 54 and have a list of problems due to prolonged use..at low to moderate doses..So,you think higher doses will yield less??..that old"if everything is equal"..well it never is or will be..
    The 80 to 90% of us never will step on stage and pose..the largest part of us are just regular working class guys that want to be bigger,stronger or whatever..and are here to learn and share..any of us that have been here for anything more than a couple of years see all kinds of plain stupid stuff..the majority of threads are from New guys that want to re-invent the wheel..1st cycle Tren..we have all seen those threads..with all the info at the touch of fingers,but still want to be spoon feed..
    Lastly...more is not better..find what works for you..risk vs reward..
    So do we hide the truth so the New Guy does not see it?

    We have all the information needed here for the New Guy to structure a good first cycle with practically no risk to New Guys health.

    Do you have a link to a thread that elaborates on your health issues and the type of usage that precipitated them? You and I are basically the same age, and I could probably learn a lot by reading it. I just competed for the first time this year.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by christiantt View Post
    Me, personally, I take an interested voyeur approach to the world Monstro lives in and what the pros do. I will never live that life or take those gear protocols myself, but I find it interesting.
    Definite voyeuristic interest here as well!

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    This post is to show all the newbies and beginners this is not the way to go ( only if you want to die young or have huge health problems ) the pros pros do as a job to earn money. Almost all of us cant ever in life have money to do cycles like the pros ( Its ALOT of money ) and dont worth the risk . When you chose to compete you know you will push your body to extreme and stress that never compensate , just to earn a medal or trophy ( dont worth to compete , i said this so many times ) .

    But i think is important to have here this kind of information to show all of you this is not the way to go and mostly because knowlage is power and im always ready to learn more and more

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    If you donít have the genetics and need 4-5grams of gear why bother? User beware going down this long hard road that always ends disastrous.

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