homwbrew Sust tweak

Hi Guys could you please give me some advice and tweaks..on some homebrewing..happy to pay for detailed advice..
I'm making some sust 250 as I usually use Enanthate and want to change my next cycle..


Im used to making Enanthate and equipoise. And attempted to make a tiny batch of sust using the same methods as Enanthate.
I'm going
BA 2 %
BB 18%
With grapeseed oil


The first batch was cloudy my friend said to use Ethyl oleate, but I couldn't get any..


However I had another go using exactly the same
BA 2 %
BB 18%
With grapeseed oil

And the second batch was fine




I'm going to brew 25grams of powder today and don't want the crash again...are you guys happy with my forumula


BA 2 %
BB 18%
With grapeseed oil



Is it solid for sustanon or any recommendations?
I'm


Thanks everyone for your help
T

2/15-20 is common, depends on concentration. 18 is fine. Did you try reheating the first small batch that was cloudy? What temp was used? My hot plate/mag stir is programmable so I've always programmed a slow ramp up and slow ramp down on temp. Quick decreases in temps can crash solutions. EO is a great solvent, usually used in higher concentration solutions though, it is also used to thin it out the oil.

Cloudy I would add 5% BB and reheat then filter again .45filter. It will like,the mgs off some But not enough to really notice .


I hate EO cause it disagrees with me . Next time I would use a different carrier oil just in my opinion of course . U can pm me if u need any more help or have any question I'll be glad to help u .

Thanks Waterboy..
your post is really helpful. I'm going to send you a Pm

Thanks you so much both of you

The cloudy batch is from moisture getting in your oil or vials somehow. That's what it is 100 out of 100 times and once it's cloudy there's nothing you can do. Just leave it it won't hurt anything. You can try adding BB or heating it up if you want but you are gonna just waste your time.

Bigjack84 said:

The cloudy batch is from moisture getting in your oil or vials somehow. That's what it is 100 out of 100 times and once it's cloudy there's nothing you can do. Just leave it it won't hurt anything. You can try adding BB or heating it up if you want but you are gonna just waste your time.

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Lmao !!! Come on now why would u trying to mess him up for no reason ?? Don't listen to that at all brother!!

If u add BB and reheat it and refilter .45 it will clear up for the most part !! I promise u that !!

Dude no one is trying to mess you up. You got moisture in your gear . Its not a big deal . I have been brewing for a long time and I have had cloudy gear more times then I can count. Adding BB to your gear and heating it up is not gonna make a difference and if it makes any difference it won't be a big enough one to go through the trouble. Cloudy gear is not going to hurt you. The best way to stop cloudy gear is to prevent it. Instead of using a double boiler use your oven and dissolve your powder in muffin tins. That way you take water out of the equation. That should do the trick.

You dont even need to add 5%. 2% is good and revisit your heating method. And maybe heat it longer and stir more often to get it to breakdown fully


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Heat again with a syringe, to let the pressure (steam) out..you got moisture in your brew

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Moisture + gear = pip. Do as advised above inset a needle and heat up in oven or on hotplate in order to remove moisture.

Sedd said:

Moisture + gear = pip. Do as advised above inset a needle and heat up in oven or on hotplate in order to remove moisture.

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What are u even talking about. How would u get moisture in the gear. U do that by venting it which is eternally stupid and so is baking gear


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ILIFT2LIVE said:

What are u even talking about. How would u get moisture in the gear. U do that by venting it which is eternally stupid and so is baking gear


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I take it you havent been brewing long. Sometimes raws can have moisture sometimes people use a water bath when brewing (I dont) sometimes people use cheap autoclaves without a drying cycle and have moisrure on the stopper or even alittle bit in the vial. Go ahead and just a quick google search about moisture in gear and see what you come up with

Or better yet brew up some test e and put alittle distilled water in it and see how it will become cloudy then pin it and see if it harmless or if it is some of the worst pip youve ever had.

So how did the second batch come out ? What method did u use to try to fix the first bath brother ?

Sedd said:

I take it you havent been brewing long. Sometimes raws can have moisture sometimes people use a water bath when brewing (I dont) sometimes people use cheap autoclaves without a drying cycle and have moisrure on the stopper or even alittle bit in the vial. Go ahead and just a quick google search about moisture in gear and see what you come up with

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Ya for people who have no clue. Sure. I've never had that issue.


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Sedd said:

Or better yet brew up some test e and put alittle distilled water in it and see how it will become cloudy then pin it and see if it harmless or if it is some of the worst pip youve ever had.

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Why would I do that. That would be stupid.


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He's right about the moisture if you use a hot water bath. Happened to me once out of a long time doing this. I didn't try to refilter or anything just wrote it off but my buddy used a cloudy not crashed vial once and had horrible pain. I do use a hot water bath and it only happened once. I don't know why it happened that time nothing seemed different.

That's why you do a IPA bath.


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No need for any type of bath. You can use a heated magnetic stir plate that is amazing or just a regular hot plate with a beaker. If you insist on using a bath for even heating then why not put your beaker on the hotplate than surround the beaker with sand? Oilbaths are dangerous as they can catch fire and they are messy. Water baths can put moisture in your gear

A heated magnetic stir plate and a stir bar on ebay or amazon are less than $100. I highly recommend every homebrewer have on because it will make everythong so much easier especially getting tren to dissolve without heat. You can add tren ba bb and then stir for hours until completely dissolved.

I do appoligize for being a smart ass. That post was for the people saying that moisture is no issue to go ahead and try it out. Please do not actually do this as the pip will be horrific.

Also $20 worth of drierite for any kind of bulk powders is really helpful. Drierite will bring moisture content on just about anything down to it's practical minimum. Makes working with any kind of powder easier and prolongs shelf life. It is reusable just by baking it in an oven. Once you see what $20 of the stuff can do with no effort on your part and no risk of degrading your compounds it becomes the only smart choice for you.

JRotten said:

Also $20 worth of drierite for any kind of bulk powders is really helpful. Drierite will bring moisture content on just about anything down to it's practical minimum. Makes working with any kind of powder easier and prolongs shelf life. It is reusable just by baking it in an oven. Once you see what $20 of the stuff can do with no effort on your part and no risk of degrading your compounds it becomes the only smart choice for you.

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Another choice for dessicant, and easily found OTC, is damprid. Damprid is calcium chloride and can also be regenerated in the oven. A simple DIY dessicator can be made by using a well sealing box, like the lock&lock brand, placing about an inch deep of damprid in the bottom, then put your raw on a thin aluminum pan(like a throwaway turkey pan or baking pan) that fits inside the box. Place the pan on top of the damprid with the raw in it, seal up the box. In 24hrs, the raw should be as dry as it is going to get.

Phil6502 said:

Another choice for dessicant, and easily found OTC, is damprid. Damprid is calcium chloride and can also be regenerated in the oven. A simple DIY dessicator can be made by using a well sealing box, like the lock&lock brand, placing about an inch deep of damprid in the bottom, then put your raw on a thin aluminum pan(like a throwaway turkey pan or baking pan) that fits inside the box. Place the pan on top of the damprid with the raw in it, seal up the box. In 24hrs, the raw should be as dry as it is going to get.

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I forget damprid even exists. It is a stronger dessicant and you can buy it anywhere that sales paint or cleaning supplies, so homedepot and Walmart both have it. I prefer drierite because it is easier to work with chunks than powder, but damprid seems to be more popular. I kind of want to test the two now and see if you actually get a measurable difference in results or if one actually works better in practice. A bucket of damprid definitely looks less odd in the kitchen than a large bottle of drierite. Lol

JRotten said:

I forget damprid even exists. It is a stronger dessicant and you can buy it anywhere that sales paint or cleaning supplies, so homedepot and Walmart both have it. I prefer drierite because it is easier to work with chunks than powder, but damprid seems to be more popular. I kind of want to test the two now and see if you actually get a measurable difference in results or if one actually works better in practice. A bucket of damprid definitely looks less odd in the kitchen than a large bottle of drierite. Lol

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Not sure about dryrite, but damprid will absorb enough water to almost dissolve itself. The benefit to dryrite, it usually has an indicator and turns pink when no longer able to absorb anymore water.

Phil6502 said:

Not sure about dryrite, but damprid will absorb enough water to almost dissolve itself. The benefit to dryrite, it usually has an indicator and turns pink when no longer able to absorb anymore water.

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The main benefit of dryrite is really that it doesn't absorb so much water to be unusable or difficult to work with again and it is pretty selective so you aren't going to absorb your work if it can evaporate. The drierite won't absorb enough water to affect it's structure. In theory you just need more drierite in the container but I'm curious now if damprid woiod actually bring down the total water content than drierite if amounts of dessicant don't matter.

either can be had with an indicator, but the indicators are toxic to some degree where the dessicants themselves are. I just bake it after use so indicating really matter to me but others I'm sure care.

For our purposes, anhydrous chemical desiccants(dryrite/damprid) will only absorb water(lets not get picky about drying gasses or other things) from the raws. Since none of the compounds we use are in the hydrate form, but are instead freebases or esters, no change will come from being in direct/indirect contact with the desiccant, but I wouldn't let the desiccant touch the raw powder. Again, were only talking about the raws containing less than 1% water. In most cases, this is insignificant, but, It sure won't hurt to keep them over a desiccant for 24-48hrs prior to brewing just for a little more precise and repeatable brewing conditions. In reality, even something like the miglyol 840 has an acceptable limit of 0.1% water content. We wouldn't see any problems until the water percentage starts getting above it's saturation point in the completed mixture. Since most(maybe all) of the compounds in question are not hygroscopic, once they are dry, they will stay that way.

Everything has some degree of vapor pressure above it, even if it is in solid form. This is what gives us the ability to smell things, even if most(almost all) of what we think we are smelling is solid, some tiny ppm or less amount of it will be in vapor phase. Desiccants that we would be using won't change the sublimation rate/vapor pressure over the raws, if they did, the effect would be so minimal as to be practically unmeasurable. Even when trying to cause many chemicals to sublime in any appreciable amount, reduced pressure and increased temperature is still required.

I just reread your post, I misunderstood that you were talking about the structure of the desiccant, not the raws, anyway, I'll leave what I said above there.

Molecular sieves are the best balance between water affinity, capacity, and re-usability. And would be my choice if I wanted to make sure the carrier oil, BA, and BB I was using was also totally dry.

Dryrite is a little easier to use because of the almost always present indicator.

Damprid is going to be easiest to get OTC, but OTC won't have an indicator, and will clump up when you reheat to regenerate.

If you have to order something, I'd get 3A molecular sieves, but then again I would use them for drying other things too, like ethanol. If you only plan on using the desiccant for what we're talking about, I'd order dryrite because of the granular nature, ease of handling, and the indicator. If I wanted convenience, I'd get some damprid, then throw it away after I dried the batch I was about to brew.

Any desiccant, given appropriate time 24-48hrs, will achieve the same level of dryness in the raws, so all the rest is academic/preference.

I think we just restated each other, but on the academic front: do you actually know how "dry" it is possible to get something with a dessicant like this? I know for instance that I can get a mushroom so dry that it won't rot, but I'm curious from an academic standpoint if one dessicant can go lower than another or if just the method itself is going to be the limiting factor?