Autoclaving vials and "wet packs"

My question is about sterilizing vials before filling with filtered gear.... I peel-packed multiple packs of 25 vials, butyl stoppers and flip-top caps so I could autoclave them. I have a portable steam sterilizer autoclave (Olizee brand; purchased from Amazon for $200). Whenever I autoclave them, the packs come out wet, as these types of sterilizers don't have a drying cycle.... does anyone else use these autoclaves? What do you do to dry your packs? I was thinking of throwing them in the oven afterwards.... I figure 360 degrees for 2 hours after an hour in the autoclave. This is obviously excessive, but when double peel-packed, they should remake sterile for multiple years, so prep time isn't really an issue as much as ensuring my process works. For my batch last week, I had a buddy at work sterilize them (I'm an Operating Room RN, so we have access to the good stuff), but I don't want to continually use the equipment at work for subsequent batches, as this is risky...


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It'd be interesting to see some science behind the autoclave or baking techniques of sterilization. I wonder how any bacteria, fungus, or virus can survive as low as 250 degrees for even 5 minutes but it must be possible (when they're in a hardened cyst form I assume) otherwise these procedures would be much simpler and shorter.

chocolatemalt said:

It'd be interesting to see some science behind the autoclave or baking techniques of sterilization. I wonder how any bacteria, fungus, or virus can survive as low as 250 degrees for even 5 minutes but it must be possible (when they're in a hardened cyst form I assume) otherwise these procedures would be much simpler and shorter.

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You're not far off, as the standard in most hospitals is 275 degrees for 5 minutes. However, the surface area of the item you're sterilizing has to reach this temperature, not just the environment itself. For example, if your oven is 300 degrees, and you put something in it, you have to wait until that item heats up to 300 itself before that 5 minutes can start. That's why the use of steam sterilization is so popular; the steam and pressure penetrate the items to be sterilize and heat them much faster than dry heating alone. That being said, there are many items that cannot be sterilized in many different ways... you can't sterilize a laparoscopic camera with steam sterilization without damaging it, so you have to use chemical sterilization. Some items can handle the pressure of an autoclave, so dry heat is a better option.


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how big is this sterilizer, ive never actually researched portable sterilizers like that before, is it a gravity or vacuum steam sterilizer? have you ever tried a bowe dick test or the use of biological indicators? and couldnt you just let the vials sit in the sterilizers til they dry as long as the sterilizer is sealed?

masseffect said:

how big is this sterilizer, ive never actually researched portable sterilizers like that before, is it a gravity or vacuum steam sterilizer? have you ever tried a bowe dick test or the use of biological indicators? and couldnt you just let the vials sit in the sterilizers til they dry as long as the sterilizer is sealed?

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It's 18L capacity. Here's a Amazon link so you can see it: https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B01A2CW5KI/ref=sxts1_a_it?ie=UTF8&qid=1490732827&sr=1

I've left the packs in overnight in this thing and they don't dry. It would take forever. My original intentions were to sterilize a bunch of packs and store them for when I'm ready. But if they are wet and they touch anything not sterile, the bacteria can enter the pack through the moisture.... my workaround that I've found has been to sterilize what I want to use when I want to use it, and when it's done, I use sterile gloves to pull them out of the sterilizer and place them onto a sterile drape. It works....

And yes, I use indicators in the pack, so I know they are being sterilized initially; just want to make sure I don't contaminate them immediately after.


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Murse32 said:

It's 18L capacity. Here's a Amazon link so you can see it: https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B01A2CW5KI/ref=sxts1_a_it?ie=UTF8&qid=1490732827&sr=1

I've left the packs in overnight in this thing and they don't dry. It would take forever. My original intentions were to sterilize a bunch of packs and store them for when I'm ready. But if they are wet and they touch anything not sterile, the bacteria can enter the pack through the moisture.... my workaround that I've found has been to sterilize what I want to use when I want to use it, and when it's done, I use sterile gloves to pull them out of the sterilizer and place them onto a sterile drape. It works....

And yes, I use indicators in the pack, so I know they are being sterilized initially; just want to make sure I don't contaminate them immediately after.


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Thats a good idea, suckers must be hot though, I never gave thought to portable sterilizers being possible im used to the gigantic ones that process carts of trays at a time lol. would you mind if I pm'd u a question about homebrew?

masseffect said:

Thats a good idea, suckers must be hot though, I never gave thought to portable sterilizers being possible im used to the gigantic ones that process carts of trays at a time lol. would you mind if I pm'd u a question about homebrew?

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I work in surgery and have used those sterilizers too.... I'd just rather not bring bags of empty vials to work. Raises suspicions, lol. And feel free to PM me


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A pressure cooker works perfect for sterilization. I have one of the presto 16 quart versions with a pressure gauge. Realistically, there is no difference using dry heat vs steam vs chemical sterilization, and what works best is whichever is going to be less prone to contamination during prep.

I've done work sterilizing grain/popcorn for mycological uses, and that stuff can be a bit temperamental. If you're concerned with bacterial endospores contaminating anything, the best procedure to use is steam sterilization followed by dry heat or chemical 24 hours later. This gives the bacterial endospores time to germinate before you destroy them with the second sterilization protocol. But this is overkill, really, unless you have reason to believe your material is contaminated.

The oil or raw itself is the most likely to be contaminated, but it is sterilized by filtration, which is a USP verified method.

Phil6502 said:

A pressure cooker works perfect for sterilization. I have one of the presto 16 quart versions with a pressure gauge. Realistically, there is no difference using dry heat vs steam vs chemical sterilization, and what works best is whichever is going to be less prone to contamination during prep.

I've done work sterilizing grain/popcorn for mycological uses, and that stuff can be a bit temperamental. If you're concerned with bacterial endospores contaminating anything, the best procedure to use is steam sterilization followed by dry heat or chemical 24 hours later. This gives the bacterial endospores time to germinate before you destroy them with the second sterilization protocol. But this is overkill, really, unless you have reason to believe your material is contaminated.

The oil or raw itself is the most likely to be contaminated, but it is sterilized by filtration, which is a USP verified method.

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Forum software wouldn't let me rep you again. Cool info!

That method of germination and extermination you mentioned reminds me of my dirt patch sterilization method when I need to eliminate all the weeds and weed seeds on a garden plot (especially those fucking goatheads): Water the whole area very well, then put a black tarp over it held down with bricks and wait a couple weeks. Under a full sun is ideal. All the seeds sprout and bake, getting WAY too hot for any to survive. No sunlight either, no love at all. Works like a charm.

You can also do an ipa bath with 90% ipa. Then bake for 60 min at 1 hour. And the stoppers too. Keep them face down on the tray and then while still farely warm while wearing sterile gloves ypu can put the stopper to the vial and then store them till needed. Ive done this and also had a buddy test my solution as he worled grave yard at a water treatment plant and it cane up 0.0000000 on the test zero contaminents zero bacteria zero anything


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I have been using dry heat to sterilize one last time immediately before capping. Cook on heat source, filter, fill, bake, cap. The hormone can take the heat. Bacteria can't......except for a couple strains. Tren is less heat tolerant than the others, so 125 for 2 hours is what I do. Others go 250 for 1 hour. Started this process after a contamination occurred. I verified the contamination was legit, and not some bs story to get free gear, and used this process to salvage the batch. Dry heat for the appropriate length of time is 99.99% effective. I use this method on every cook now and have had nothing but positive feedback from customers. The gear is clean and the proper dosage. No autoclave and moisture to worry about.

And the BA boils at over 400f, so degradation is not a problem.

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I have been using dry heat to sterilize one last time immediately before capping. Cook on heat source, filter, fill, bake, cap. The hormone can take the heat. Bacteria can't......except for a couple strains. Tren is less heat tolerant than the others, so 125 for 2 hours is what I do. Others go 250 for 1 hour. Started this process after a contamination occurred. I verified the contamination was legit, and not some bs story to get free gear, and used this process to salvage the batch. Dry heat for the appropriate length of time is 99.99% effective. I use this method on every cook now and have had nothing but positive feedback from customers. The gear is clean and the proper dosage. No autoclave and moisture to worry about.

And the BA boils at over 400f, so degradation is not a problem.

Vacuum seal the packs before sterilizing. Unless your autoclave is significantly different than a pressure cooker it's not contact with the steam that is doing the work, it's the heat and pressure. I've done this for mycology. There really shouldn't be any reason for things to get wet.

ILIFT2LIVE said:

You can also do an ipa bath with 90% ipa. Then bake for 60 min at 1 hour. And the stoppers too. Keep them face down on the tray and then while still farely warm while wearing sterile gloves ypu can put the stopper to the vial and then store them till needed. Ive done this and also had a buddy test my solution as he worled grave yard at a water treatment plant and it cane up 0.0000000 on the test zero contaminents zero bacteria zero anything


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I'd love to see the instrumentation that can test for that level of precision, lol. I'll give you a hint, they don't exist.

That would be zero parts per BILLION.

No wastewater or drinking water plant I've ever seen has the right amount of growth mediums to test for any bacteria but fecal coliform and e. coli.(most of these tests are performed on a specific type of filter medium that changes color to indicate an approximate concentration of these type of bacterium, they arent even really growing anything on agar plates, which is what would need to be done to prove sterility, and is how it is done pharmaceuticaly) It is taken as a given in these water systems that if there is not sufficient fecal coliform or e. coli(the predominant one changes by season), then it is taken as an ASSUMED given that there is also not a sufficient number of other potentially toxic bacterium present.

Not to mention, I've never heard of them routinely running mass spec or NMR before, not to mention the PCR analysis that would need to be done to confirm that the solution was truly dna/rna free(as in free of any viral contamination)

You've just been a regular pyrite mine as far as I can tell...

Phil6502 said:

I'd love to see the instrumentation that can test for that level of precision, lol. I'll give you a hint, they don't exist.

That would be zero parts per BILLION.

No wastewater or drinking water plant I've ever seen has the right amount of growth mediums to test for any bacteria but fecal coliform and e. coli.(most of these tests are performed on a specific type of filter medium that changes color to indicate an approximate concentration of these type of bacterium, they arent even really growing anything on agar plates, which is what would need to be done to prove sterility, and is how it is done pharmaceuticaly) It is taken as a given in these water systems that if there is not sufficient fecal coliform or e. coli(the predominant one changes by season), then it is taken as an ASSUMED given that there is also not a sufficient number of other potentially toxic bacterium present.

Not to mention, I've never heard of them routinely running mass spec or NMR before, not to mention the PCR analysis that would need to be done to confirm that the solution was truly dna/rna free(as in free of any viral contamination)

You've just been a regular pyrite mine as far as I can tell...

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Yes billion I know. That's what I was told. I can only believe what I was told. And never in the time I've been doing this have I had an issue w injections. So you can say what I want. Idc.


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