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Elevated BP on TRT due to increased RBC count?

Ronthebadass

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Now, my blood pressure isn't high (90 over 50) but I expect that to rise on TRT (6th week in). It would take a long time to actually get that number anywhere close to high I would think; although, I am at a TRT clinic who mainly deals with athletes - so my T is 35 at a trough xD lol, and I was wondering to keep my RBC (Red Blood Cell) count down, would twice a year blood donations keep it down or maybe a bit more?

Currently on 350mg test a week (I realise it's alot, probably drop it back a bit soon, but no real health risk I don't think?) and .3mg Adex a week, thanks guys.

Any personal experience, even if you've never had to would be appreciate and would add to a growing pool of knowledge I'm attempting to gain.
 
It depends how your body reacts to the test.... Deca REALLY blows up my RBCs, way more than test did on my cruise... You kind of have to figure out what works best for you. Giving blood is free, I give every 8 weeks if I'm on gear or not, I make it part of the lifestyle like using gear and dieting... There is also supplements like low dose aspirin that'll thin out the blood, Cialis, celery seed pills, nattokinase, serrapeptase, mild BP meds, or just a lot of water throughout the day.. Since your BP is WAY low, I would just start by drinking lots of water and blood donations once in a while and go from there... Good luck!!
 
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Your bloodwork will tell you where your RBC is at and if you are doing true trt it's not likely that your RBC would be rising at a rate Sao quickly that it won't be caught on labs. As was stated, people that don't do TRT are perfectly capable of donating blood every 56 days. It's healthy for you and saves lives So if you're eligible, why not do it?. Unless you are competing in endurance sports where that high RBC count could be beneficial I think you are overthinking the whole thing.
 
Your blood pressure is great, I don't think you have any worries there if you're just doing HRT. From my personal experience, (been on HRT for 2 years now) RBC will increase over time. I do like others have said, donate every 8-10 weeks and it really helps keep things in check.
 
Really helpful stuff guys, thank you very much. I realise I am overthinking it but that's just my personality :D

I get that... I'll get some bloods done whenever I can get around to it in the next few months and get everything checked out.

You all have the attitude to donate as much as possible and it does have it's health benefits as well as being a very good thing to do for someone who needs it so I will definitely go to sign up and give every three months because that's just easier for me. Plus a lot of my family are some rare blood type so hopefully I have it as well!

Thanks for all the info on the supps to keep BP down, I will keep the list of them in my draw incase it ever does somehow get a bit high, although I don't reckon it will, just wanna be on top of things.

Thanks for all the helpful words, guys. You can know something is true, but it helps still to hear it confirmed by others.
 
Wait do you mean 90 over 150?


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I'm only speculating but that's impossible. 90 over 120 or 150 is hypertensive but there is no 90/50


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I'm only speculating but that's impossible. 90 over 120 or 150 is hypertensive but there is no 90/50


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hmmm, I am not a qualified MD, all I know is that they say one number should be ideally 120 (mine is 90) and the other should be 80 (mine is 50) and the nurse and Dr told me it was excellent?
 
I'm only speculating but that's impossible. 90 over 120 or 150 is hypertensive but there is no 90/50


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90/50 is definitely possible. Numbers that low can be seen in some distance athletes, or cases of dehydration.
 
IML Gear Cream!
90/50? Whoa. That diastolic is low homey. And this ^^. Your systolic even
 
90/50 is definitely possible. Numbers that low can be seen in some distance athletes, or cases of dehydration.

Definitely not dehydrated, I drink around 5L of water a day. On the other hand, I am somewhat a distance athlete but I'd rather not say in what sport just because TRT isn't an accepted thing yet.
 
First & Foremost: 350mg/week of testosterone is NOT TRT or HRT (never has been/never will be); that is a lower dosed "cycle" or "blast"
 
First & Foremost: 350mg/week of testosterone is NOT TRT or HRT (never has been/never will be); that is a lower dosed "cycle" or "blast"

Is with this clinic I was sent to. A cycle or blast is defined as a higher than usual dose of T being injected (be that higher than your natural T or higher than your usual cruise dose), for 8-12 weeks along with other drugs. If anything, this is considered cruising as I am on it for life.
 
Is with this clinic I was sent to. A cycle or blast is defined as a higher than usual dose of T being injected (be that higher than your natural T or higher than your usual cruise dose), for 8-12 weeks along with other drugs. If anything, this is considered cruising as I am on it for life.

You are wrong
you are cruising at a blast blood level
natural levels will never exceed 1000 much less way higher than that
legal trt prescribed cruise range is between 100-200 a week; you are almost double the actual TRT amount
at your level you are doing blasts which aren't recommended for long term health and not to stay at that dose life long unless you are like a 330lb lean jacked mofo that needs that much test to maintain your mass...

your clinic is a health or Beauty/ageless/or rejuvenation clinic which basically scews the legal and medical boundaries to whats their patients pay for or are willing to pay for.... That does not make your dose of 350 a week a healthy dose or much less. Proper one to be classified as TRT or cruising... It's classified as external for other use such as ant-aging and whatever the clinic puts its secondary use as.
 
Definitely not dehydrated, I drink around 5L of water a day. On the other hand, I am somewhat a distance athlete but I'd rather not say in what sport just because TRT isn't an accepted thing yet.

Your BP is a little low, but in the absence of other health issues and if you frequently engage in intense cardiovascular exercise, it's nothing to worry about at all. Endurance athletes often have blood pressure readings that are far lower than the general public.

It's also advised to take multiple BP readings throughout the day to get a better idea of your average blood pressure. It may not always be that low.
 
You are wrong
you are cruising at a blast blood level
natural levels will never exceed 1000 much less way higher than that
legal trt prescribed cruise range is between 100-200 a week; you are almost double the actual TRT amount
at your level you are doing blasts which aren't recommended for long term health and not to stay at that dose life long unless you are like a 330lb lean jacked mofo that needs that much test to maintain your mass...

your clinic is a health or Beauty/ageless/or rejuvenation clinic which basically scews the legal and medical boundaries to whats their patients pay for or are willing to pay for.... That does not make your dose of 350 a week a healthy dose or much less. Proper one to be classified as TRT or cruising... It's classified as external for other use such as ant-aging and whatever the clinic puts its secondary use as.

No, you are. You said I was blasting, now you admit I'm cruising. You said I was at a dose lower than blast level, now you say I'm cruising at a blast level. You're contradicting yourself and seem to not have clue what you're talking about from my perspective.

Natural testosterone has been recorded at over 1000 frequently, bud. It's in pathologies blood level ranges so all you have to do is call a pathology and ask for ranges to see that your statement is false.

I surely am, sir, I surely am nearly double the normal amount. 200mg Pro, 150mg Cyp, rocking it like it's going out of style.

Can you explain why this level of Testosterone isn't recommended long term? Cite some information?

And LoL at you thinking a 330lb lean guy only uses this dose of T... you are so misinformed.

MY DRs screw the legal system and screwed me out of thousands of dollars as I sat at home wanting to kill myself for two years straight, taking my money and misleading me. I got screwed so it's time everyone else got the same, fuck the mother fucking legal system.

I feel awesome now, and for the first time I have T in my body, I am growing arm hair ffs, something that simple makes me so happy. My voice is deepening slowly.

I know you're a bit butt hurt Rambo but seriously, let it go dude. Got no interest in continually talking crap to you or anyone on here.
 
Your BP is a little low, but in the absence of other health issues and if you frequently engage in intense cardiovascular exercise, it's nothing to worry about at all. Endurance athletes often have blood pressure readings that are far lower than the general public.

It's also advised to take multiple BP readings throughout the day to get a better idea of your average blood pressure. It may not always be that low.

I know it... thanks for the calmly words though! Intensive cardiovascular and strength training almost everyday so I'm all good. True, noticed that now people have pointed it out.

Rightio... I will definitely try and do that although I don't have a machine at home but I'll ask about it to a couple guys, thank you!
 
No, you are. You said I was blasting, now you admit I'm cruising. You said I was at a dose lower than blast level, now you say I'm cruising at a blast level. You're contradicting yourself and seem to not have clue what you're talking about from my perspective.

Natural testosterone has been recorded at over 1000 frequently, bud. It's in pathologies blood level ranges so all you have to do is call a pathology and ask for ranges to see that your statement is false.

I surely am, sir, I surely am nearly double the normal amount. 200mg Pro, 150mg Cyp, rocking it like it's going out of style.

Can you explain why this level of Testosterone isn't recommended long term? Cite some information?

And LoL at you thinking a 330lb lean guy only uses this dose of T... you are so misinformed.

MY DRs screw the legal system and screwed me out of thousands of dollars as I sat at home wanting to kill myself for two years straight, taking my money and misleading me. I got screwed so it's time everyone else got the same, fuck the mother fucking legal system.

I feel awesome now, and for the first time I have T in my body, I am growing arm hair ffs, something that simple makes me so happy. My voice is deepening slowly.

I know you're a bit butt hurt Rambo but seriously, let it go dude. Got no interest in continually talking crap to you or anyone on here.

you must clearly be illiterate... I said you are "cruising at a blast blood level" (exact words) meaning you are using it as a cruise but it is not a legally trt dosed nor proper cruise as your blood level is way elevated beyond natural or trt levels.... trt levels should not really be above 1000 ever... also trt dose ranges from 100-200 testosterone... you are taking 350 which is double the standard cruise dose for trt... you are essentially blasting and putting un-needed stress on your body if you attempt to hold that dose for a cruise as it will be too high to maintain for health reasons... its a blast you just want to use it as a cruise... anything about 200 is typically blast levels; the only difference is most people blast with around 400-500/wk begining and do that for 12weeks although even 300/wk would provide a good blast and gains since it is way above natural levels.... so yes you are holding "blast blood levels" and trying to justify your "cruising" on elevated levels which is all fine however it may not be beneficial in the long run... lipids and other profiles star being affected sometimes by some users as well as increased E and Heart issues may pose a health hazard. Our body lowers testosterone levels naturally as we age in order to help our heart cope and survive; you are doubling levels that of a normal healthy teen during puberty meaning you are stressing yourself healthwise thats why we dont cruise on such high doses only temporary elevated periods which we call "blasts" and in your case you want to justify a high dose and turn it into a cruise which is physically possible but not considered trt nor recommended
 
you must clearly be illiterate... I said you are "cruising at a blast blood level" (exact words) meaning you are using it as a cruise but it is not a legally trt dosed nor proper cruise as your blood level is way elevated beyond natural or trt levels.... trt levels should not really be above 1000 ever... also trt dose ranges from 100-200 testosterone... you are taking 350 which is double the standard cruise dose for trt... you are essentially blasting and putting un-needed stress on your body if you attempt to hold that dose for a cruise as it will be too high to maintain for health reasons... its a blast you just want to use it as a cruise... anything about 200 is typically blast levels; the only difference is most people blast with around 400-500/wk begining and do that for 12weeks although even 300/wk would provide a good blast and gains since it is way above natural levels.... so yes you are holding "blast blood levels" and trying to justify your "cruising" on elevated levels which is all fine however it may not be beneficial in the long run... lipids and other profiles star being affected sometimes by some users as well as increased E and Heart issues may pose a health hazard. Our body lowers testosterone levels naturally as we age in order to help our heart cope and survive; you are doubling levels that of a normal healthy teen during puberty meaning you are stressing yourself healthwise thats why we dont cruise on such high doses only temporary elevated periods which we call "blasts" and in your case you want to justify a high dose and turn it into a cruise which is physically possible but not considered trt nor recommended

You have no grounds to neg, and you've done it twice now for no reason.

I will not converse with you further because you are obviously too egotistical to see clearly.

Re-read my posts and you'll see I am neither illiterate or ignorant, I am more informed than yourself.
 
Get Shredded!
you must clearly be illiterate... I said you are "cruising at a blast blood level" (exact words) meaning you are using it as a cruise but it is not a legally trt dosed nor proper cruise as your blood level is way elevated beyond natural or trt levels.... trt levels should not really be above 1000 ever... also trt dose ranges from 100-200 testosterone... you are taking 350 which is double the standard cruise dose for trt... you are essentially blasting and putting un-needed stress on your body if you attempt to hold that dose for a cruise as it will be too high to maintain for health reasons... its a blast you just want to use it as a cruise... anything about 200 is typically blast levels; the only difference is most people blast with around 400-500/wk begining and do that for 12weeks although even 300/wk would provide a good blast and gains since it is way above natural levels.... so yes you are holding "blast blood levels" and trying to justify your "cruising" on elevated levels which is all fine however it may not be beneficial in the long run... lipids and other profiles star being affected sometimes by some users as well as increased E and Heart issues may pose a health hazard. Our body lowers testosterone levels naturally as we age in order to help our heart cope and survive; you are doubling levels that of a normal healthy teen during puberty meaning you are stressing yourself healthwise thats why we dont cruise on such high doses only temporary elevated periods which we call "blasts" and in your case you want to justify a high dose and turn it into a cruise which is physically possible but not considered trt nor recommended

"350mg/week of testosterone is NOT TRT or HRT (never has been/never will be); that is a lower dosed "cycle" or "blast""

"most people blast with around 400-500/wk"

"you are cruising at a blast blood level"

Direct quotes from you, contradicting yourself.

GFYC
 
No clinic worth their salt will let you run around with test levels over 1100 for any length of time, doing so risks their practice and your health. Many shady clinic will put patients on higher than normal TRT dose to start with to get them hooked on the quick gains but eventually, if they value their license, cut it back. If your blood levels are over the high end of lab range and thats your TRT dose then you DO have long term health concerns to worry about.
 
No clinic worth their salt will let you run around with test levels over 1100 for any length of time, doing so risks their practice and your health. Many shady clinic will put patients on higher than normal TRT dose to start with to get them hooked on the quick gains but eventually, if they value their license, cut it back. If your blood levels are over the high end of lab range and thats your TRT dose then you DO have long term health concerns to worry about.

Exactly what is happening with me, dose is upped and will drop eventually, and if we take a look at what this thread is actually about for a second, we realise that we have gotten extremely side tracked from the thread's actual purpose.

Could you please explain the long-term health concerns?
 
Long term health concerns are primarily cardiovascular in nature. Elevated RBC counts thicken the blood, increase clotting risk and slowly over time stress the heart AND the arteries. In the heart this causes increased heart size and wall thickness. The added viscosity also wreaks havoc on the arterial walls. Already heart attacks are the leading killer and by and large totally avoidable. I wont go into the whole thing but arterial health relies heavily on specific nutrients, nutrients that are lacking big time in the average diet. Exercise increases heart rate which increases pressure in the arteries. Arteries are elastic like, think of a rubber band. Take 2 rubber bands stretch one out 60 times a minute and another 120 times a minute which will fail first?

Unlike the rubber band our arteries have the ability to heal damage IF and that is a big IF the body has adequate nutrients to do so. So the average athletic person subjects their heart and vascular system to more stress than the average couch potato thereby causing more damage and in turn the need for more nutrients for repair. How many times have you heard of a pro wrestler having heart failure or some jogger or marathon runner dropping dead? The damage is invisible and insidious and the medical system does NOT properly check for things that would indicate the underlying change is taking place. Even when you present to the clinic with heart problems most of the needed tests are never run, they just toss a couple scripts at you, I know, ive been there and have talked to many others in the same boat.

So at the end of the day its your body, your life and your choice and if you fail to head the warnings about running constant high test doses you WILL someday pay for your decision.
 
I've had the same questions for a while -- what are the reasonable concerns of a "reasonable" supraphysiological (e.g. 300 mg/wk) regimen of ordinary testosterone?

There are precious few studies, so we're left looking at limited clinical data alongside a bunch of anecdotal evidence from stories of long-term bodybuilders with bad outcomes... evidence often polluted of course with lots of other substances such as HGH, tren, C17 orals, dehydrating agents, Xanax, alcohol, cocaine, painkillers, etc.

In William Llewellyn's Anabolics 10th Ed. he examines three studies that are most relevant. The first is our famous testosterone dose-response paper from 2001 that tracked up to 600 mg/wk for 20 wks (http://ajpendo.physiology.org/content/281/6/E1172.full) The second tracks up to 600 mg/wk of nandrolone in HIV+ patients and the third looks at up to 100 mg/day of anadrol in 65-80 yr old men.

His conclusion:

Adding It All Up

One hundred and twenty-one men participated in these three studies, which involved the use of moderate to high doses of steroids of periods of three to five months. Although it may be shocking to most opponents of AAS use, an unbiased assessment of the metabolic changes and health risks did not reveal any significant short-term dangers. The main negative impact of steroid use in all three cases was a reduction in good (HDL) cholesterol values, which is a legitimate concern when it comes to assessing one's risk for developing cardiovascular disease. It is uncertain, however, if a short-lived increase in this particular risk factor relates to any tangible damage to one's health over the long-term. It is also unknown how much (if any) this may be offset by the other positive metabolic changes that were seen to accompany combined AAS use and exercise.

Logic would seem to suggest that the isolated use of steroids, under parameters similar to those used in these three studies, should entail relatively minimal risks to health. At the very least, it is extremely difficult to argue that an isolated cycle with a moderate drug dose is tantamount to playing Russian roulette with your body, as most media campaigns against the use of these drugs would seem to suggest. But make no mistake. These same study results consistently demonstrated pro-atherogenic changes in blood lipids with the doses necessary to physique or performance enhancement, and underline how it is that long-term AAS abuse can impair cardiovascular health.


His remarks have to do with short-term cycles but the relatively minor effects of large doses over 12-20 wks suggest it may be similarly minor for moderate doses over a longer term.

In addition to the cardiovascular impact, there is some data suggesting development of tendon rigidity (leading to increase risk of injury) but this data isn't strong and is confounded by the tendency for guys to hit the weights far harder during a cycle. The actual AAS direct effect on tendon composition may be insignificant. There's also some immunosuppressant evidence at higher doses but again it's not strong, is mixed with immunostimulant evidence, and no correlation with increased illness jumps out of the data.

In the end it seems wise to just track your own response to the gear. If you've got a ridiculously good BP, and other blood markers (RBC, HDL, LDL) are a-ok, you may have more margin of safety to work with than other dudes.
 
In the end it seems wise to just track your own response to the gear. If you've got a ridiculously good BP, and other blood markers (RBC, HDL, LDL) are a-ok, you may have more margin of safety to work with than other dudes.

And thats the key!

We dont need long term studies to know many things, very simple and accurate conclusions can be drawn often times. For example we know what long term elevated RBC levels can do and we know that high test can raise RBC levels. If your someone who has elevated RBC levels and your taking exo test and refuse to acknowledge the damage thats taking place then you get what you deserve.
 
Rightio, well it seems like RBC can be managed fairly easily and I say that from my perspective of course. The only other risk is the lowered good cholesterol factor and if that is even really a risk. I'd need to find more research on it though.

Seems like giving blood and a flax seed or fish oil supp will go a long way. I also found the things you said about abscorbic acid very interesting as well as potassium and will try those out ASAP.

Can I rep yet, lol? Some posts I just wanna rep, ya know? lol
 
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